You so took the words out of my mouth. Especially about the point you made about how people pick on others for something but its pretty hypocritical of them to do that because they were oppressed for something too... Mad props to you. :)

He's right...totally....I just never said anything because I didn't think it would change anything...but Kirby put it together real well and maybe it'll wake a few up...

I realized that in life it doesn’t matter what you look like, who you try to impress, how “cool” you are, none of that stuff matters in the real world. Those traits are always going to be coveted by some people, that’s just their natural mentality. But as punks we are supposed to be better than that and realize that we’re all the same. i dont know what fantisy world you live in but people are not created equal.

although i do agree with most of what you said, i just can't help but laugh when i read some of these comments. the arguments and insults that i find at punknews.org are one of the reasons i like this site so much. arguing over who's more punk can be annoying, but some of the insults are first class and the responses are even better. i know its not "punk" and i am too damn old to be "in the scene" anyway (first punk record - 1989). i don't even know most of these bands as I tend to listen to older stuff, but I check this site daily for the comments. i say keep em coming. but that's just my two cents.

thats all true and all and like it or not most people who get into punk start hating people who like rap or anything. Some people bash kids who dont like moshing or dancing at a show. I try to not make a big deal out of this kind of stuff when a person does nothing to me directly. I mean so what if a kid is rich and is a total joke at the show he/her goes to? They arent really hurting your expereience. And if they are then you are to big on little characteristics. Im sure punk back in its truest forms didnt have so many tie downs on "look" "actions" and "social status". Some of the biggest dicks are the punks who complain about every1 whose not like them and other things. bah

It's my triumphant return.........

Politicol correctness is not punk!!!

Its nice to see people really tackling the issues that matter. This has about as much relevance and impact on the world as whether or not Will and Grace is a rerun this week. I have never posted here before, simply read this site as a way to get info on the music i like, but seriously folks? Can't we find some causes to get worked up over that are worth our time? Sure, i have seen this type of stuff and it affects my attitudes and thoughts, but jesus....come on! A real "punk" as so many of you claim to be, would rather post their thoughts on political issues rather than if a 15 year old kid's feelings get hurt. ...and yes i realize that the fact that i am posting this is hypocritical, so PLEASE no one point that out. (smarty pants)

Amen. I'm glad someone finally spoke up about this.

this is the punk scene, the scene infamous for spitting, puking, drugs, fighting, anarchy, and crazy clothes/hair. how the hell can you give it a bad name? that unity stuff is a pipedream. the biggest jerks i have ever met are punks, and i love this scene!

punk wasn't originally about exceptance or any other bull shit issue all of that was adapted by different bands in all different time periods, it might have been what it was all about with greenday and offspring in 96, and it might be about mtv or playing emotional or complex music now, but it was originally about rebellion and the title of punk was given to bands that people thought shouldn't be playing music because they weren't musicians they were just punks or amateurs.so if you think you know what punks all about because you know about bands that have taken on that title your wrong because the only thing punk is about is non traditionaly musical people expressing them selves with noises.

The Best Comment! It seems like right now everyone is steering away from making fun of each other physically. Now it's completely mental. I guess this has to do with being hurt by my peers as a kid and doing it in return. I remember as a kid starting to listen to punk, I was going to be better than other people on my own terms. That obviously didn't work out and I found out that I was an asshole just like everyone else. So later I grew up and now I'm trying to act nicer and it's funny because I see freshmen as school (I'm a junior btw) looking like Rivers, wearing ATD-I shirts and what-not. It's funny because they seem to be going through what I did a couple years back (except I listened to punk and ska). Sometimes it's sad, but someday I hope they'll figure it out. BTW, I love ATD-I.

dude, you're totally gay

the internet is not the scene get a life. dahboard sucks, most shows aren't exciting anymore, most bands aren't exciting anymore, most kids are lame and don't appreciate good music. no jock ever smashed my glasses i don't wear them and i have social skill that are developed enough to get along with people regardless of their click or musical preferences. most people are the same at the core and common ground is easy to find.

In response to Jon The Skafather: Believe me, no one on this site is punk. I am not punk, and first person to respond to my post isn't either. Please, someone define for me punk. We have seen thousands of people say "This band is not punk because. . . . . " Is it being on an indie label? Is it being strictly DIY? Punk, to me, is like perfection. Thre is no way to reach "punk-ness." You can have a mohawk, wear lots of black, and go to every Rancid show, but coming here and bitching makes you no more punk than the 15-year-old girl who has learned every New Found Glory lyric.

Quit yer bitchin'.

isnt it a bit hypocritical to claim that punk is about "being yourself" and then telling other people to change the way they act? You have the right to hate assholes because they're assholes, but they have the right to hate you because they think you're "gay". That is them being themselves

OK I have one problem with this article. The people that commented on it saying, right on or whatever are the ones doing exactly what he is talking about. People arent going to stop they are going to agree with him and then go on to another board and say something stupid again.-pat 41

Actually the word punk itself means homosexual (look it up in a dictionary). So maybe dashboard is punk. --Big Letter Guy

I personally think that arguing over this type of things is futile. "Punk" isn't a thing. Punk is an idea that is commonly shared but everyone out there in the scene has his or her own opinion on it. I personally feel like punk is just being yourself, and not really giving a fuck what all the other assholes say about you. It is true, our music, punk, isn't the most popular, and that gives us strength as a minority but we self-destruct and hurt ourselves holding what you disagree with against someone else, like the type of "punk" they like. I mean, would you rather have a "punk" who listens to Dashboard or New Found Glory totally ditch the scene and go listen to some alt or metal rap/rock which I have more confidence in saying that most of us feel a strong distaste for? There just needs to be the second coming of Op Ivy and maybe we'll have some fuckin unity.

I couldnt agree with you more...which is why I wrote an open letter just like this about 3 months ago and it never got posted up here, what the hell happened to that?

I know how you feel man, we are all apart of an enlightend scene. What you just siad was the total reason for me getting into punk rock, to get away from the prejudice nazi bullshit that's out there. I totally agree with you that all punks are considered the same, and your also right, we are a community. This isn't about fashion or who's more punk than who. People just have to see, understand, and remember why we started the scene in the first place.....

Punk is dead in my opinion, what we see now is a rambling of hate and shit like that. I like the music but the whole "punk" scene is too much bullshit now, you don't have a mohawk, you don't like old school punk bands...thats not punk, that band isn't punk and so on and so on. nobody cares how punk you are, i could give a fuck if you have a mohwak or not...it's all about the music. People have the right to say that they hate a band and think they suck, it's all cool

I thought this was punkNEWS.org, not bitchaboutthestateofpunkrockintodayssociety.org what a fucking lame article

who the HELL would want to be labeled as a "punk"? I guess it would be cool to only listen to one genre of music(or whatever is acceptable by the scene), but funny I just don't think that makes any sense. listen to ryan adams -tbones

Just a thought: the article psoted talks about how offspring green day and rancid preached about not looing cool or making money or doing drugs? But I'm pretty sure most of them were junkies at one point and most of them use drugs right now. They all also look cool as fuck and I dont think any of them have financial problems either. PS If you cant stand the heat get out of the kitchen.

First, thanks Adam for posting the article. Second, thanks to everyone who read it. Third, those who agree maybe there is still hope in this scene and the lyrics I live my life by each day aren't just a "pipedream." Fourth, to those who keep it up, you're probably just to immature yet in life and you'll eventually learn.

For all of you that don't think this is an important issue... If we can't have unity in a scene, then how the hell are we going to have unity in this world? It really bothers me that due to religion and cultural differences that there's a chance that our lives could be over with the press of a button...

who fucking cares. what are we supposed to do all hold hands and take turns at blowing eachother. fuck off arguementing is more fun, they lead to fights and fighting is funner, smashing stuff is funner then that and, drinking and drugs are the funnest. your a sad sack of SHIT. whine whine whine all the fucking time, your whineing about whineing, what the fuck are you?? A JOKE. go out and belt some cunt because he loves a band that you totally hate, and dont feel bad. and then you can fuck off and die

I think all Kirby is trying to say here is it's stupid and pointless to make fun of someone because of what bands they listen to. Who Cares! This is why I don't participate in the message boards, too many closed minded people with way too much time on their hands. Maybe there should be a seperate message board for all you who like fighting and making fun of people, it could be called the Asshole Board.

i think a lot of people think like this but they never act on it. a lot of people will agree... some will disagree. but as soon as this post finds its way off the frontpage of this webpage, people will go back to the name calling and blah blah blah. thats what always happens, or at least thats what i see.

punk isn't dead, its evolved. unfortunately, its evolved into a scene of 15 year old wannabes, leftist tree huggers, and pop-punk bands. I'll take my 7 seconds, oppressed, and misfits cds over this new shit anyday. great site, though.

God fucking dammit!!! Stop the fucking homophobia!!! All you self righteous idiots need to stop writing on some stupid messageboard and go outside! Make a change! Stop being a bigot for no reason! Fuck! Fuck! can't you see jocks == bigots!?

I'm good friends with "kirby puckett", and what he just said was the biggest load of crap I have ever heard outta his mouth... dude, who are you trying to kid? That's funny as hell though! Short n' Sweet: I listen to what I want to listen to, you all listen to what you listen to... and stop being a bunch of pussies about it!

Ha ha ha you people make me laugh... Its just music... How you want to sub divide it after that is the individuals choice. Go read some ayn rand and figure out that you're all individual and not a collective. "punk", to me is about tearing it up. So lets get ready and rip it all to death!!!

I think this post and it's reactions are only good for one thing. Seperating those who actually get it, from those who don't. good work.

Get a clue you fucking tool. I can make fun of anyone I want anytime. I dont have any responsibility to anyone just because they listen to piles of shit like Dashboard Confessional (if someone can tell me whats "punk" about it, Id love to know). Punk is a STYLE OF MUSIC comprised of different people, some of us are assholes. Deal with it. Johnny Cash and Woody Guthrie werent punk. They had soul. Thats what seperates real punk rock from fake, and real people from clones. thank you and good night.

Maybe when your bitchass stops whining about some of us living in the real world and having jobs. Even then, I see nothing wrong with making fun of a Sid Vicious lookalike who gets dropped off to see "Lars Fredriksen and his band of merry gutter punk whores" by his mother in a fucking Mercedes Benz.

thank you; there should not be any rules in punk if its punk to you, than it's punk to you. BRING DOWN BARRIERS BRING DOWN BARRIERS BROken fence

Its a message board, damn. If you want to preach about equality, love and respect I'm sure there is a Phish site somewhere for you. Picking on people is fun, talking shit is fun, Chris from Dashboard thinks he's fucking Chris Isaak, and Weezer aren't punkrock. Shut up and dance bitch.

Thats a really great fuckin point. I think it left out the fact to accept EVERYONE, including people who don't like punk. And kids who like trendy punk, granted i like alot of underground shit and i've been heavy into the scene for like 5 years, but i still like blink 182

i can't remember the last time i've seen so much bitching about something so insignificant.

emo is shithouse thats all there is to it stb www.plonkerpunk.com

Wow, even after a post like this comes through, the ignorance of the whole lot of you continues to shine through. Forget about Dashboard, Blink, Sum 41 et all, you people need to realize that using "gay" "faggot" etc etc, is no more different that going out and using 'the "N" word' to talk about black people. Don't call yourself punk if you're closeminded enough to do that. As for the definition of "punk" I think Greg Gaffin hit it on the head with the "Punk Manifesto" over at badreligion.com

Unfortunately,these kids do give punks everywhere a bad name and take away one of the reasons that punk was special in the first place, but the immature slandering isn't necessarily a new punk thing, it's an inevitable consequence of mixing the punk scene with the internet. The internet takes away all vanity concerns that people have in public, giving complete geeks the ability to disguise themselves and pretend they're really tough people. This happens all the time on IRC, or any other mass chat programs. Just keep in mind, that we all know the harder you try to be tough on the internet, the more your trying to compensate for the real world. If you don't like people doing it to you, then don't do it to others.

Discord in any community is good, especially in the punk scene. The hardcore scene is recent years seems to have gone the way of fashion, which is strange because it started as exactly the opposite. Anyway, disagreement is good. And as you say the punk scene is currently going to shit... well, it just makes you sound old. Someone ALWAYS says that every few years, because of some reason or another. Every year a bunch of kids discover the music and put a spin on it to make it their own. Sometimes it cheapens the music, sometimes it makes it stronger. What scares you is that it makes it less YOURS. Call me a punk, Cos

I applaud you. You are genious and I agree with you 100%. I think this article should go world wide and would it be okay if I posted this places? giving you credit and everything? bc i think that ppl NEED to know this. I bet it would change their whole perspective on things. just email me and let me know bc i wont do it without your permission... workingclass7@yahoo.com

I totally agree with you and what you are saying. For all of the kids out there who have ever critisized anyone on the music they listen to, no matter what genre, or band...who are you to judge? I am so sick of hearing punk this poser that...seriously, sit down and think about what you are saying. I, for one hate Good Charlotte, but that doesn't mean I go critisizing anyone who likes it. I respect other people for what they like and for what they want to listen to. As for you who have been made fun of for what you listen to, keep on listening to whatever you want to listen to. NEVER let anyone get you down about what you listen to or the person you are. Screw them. Be yourself. Thats what matters, no one out there can judge you as a person by the music you listen to.

Punk as a mentality is dead! It's all just MUSIC now. Face it, deal with it! Tom_ep

HELL YEAH!!! I know what you mean (and I've only been in the punk scene for about 6 months!).