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More on Vandals vs. Variety

Posted by aubin on Friday, September 10, 2010 at 3:00 PM (EDT)

Billboard is reporting on the resuming of hostilities between the Daily Variety and The Vandals. According to the report, bassist (and lawyer) Joe Escalante is fighting the suit himself. He noted:

I'm spending ridiculous amounts of hours on this. Like four to 10 hours a day. It's a nightmare, but I'm learning how to do litigation. I hired a guy to teach me how to do it in Delaware.

Reed Elsevier, Variety's parent company commented on the suit as well:

While we don't expect the Vandals to see the issues through our eyes, the publicity they have generated and continue to generate contains inaccuracies, out-of-context statements and false innuendo. This is a breach of contract suit based on materials and links posted on the Vandals' websites. We look forward to a court deciding these issues.

Earlier this summer, Escalante commented on how the lawsuit was making it impossible for the band to release new material until the situation had been resolved.

Kung Fu Records (62 comments)

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Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way. Seriously.

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mattramone (September 10, 2010)

Yeah, because people are definitely going to confuse a Vandals CD with an entertainment newspaper.

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Dante3000 (rich) (September 10, 2010)

Eh, I understand the issue regarding copyright and duplication. It's the same reason a band doesn't make a "Fuck Mickey Mouse" album with Mickey's head on a pike. No one would think it's a Disney album but Disney needs to protect their image and how that image is used (well, maybe not "needs to" but has a right to).
That said, they did stop using the logo in question, so now Variety is basically mad that the internet has the logo. Fucking internets!

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mattramone (September 10, 2010)

...how do they work?

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Heathbar (September 10, 2010)

I read somewhere that there is a series of tubes. After that, I lost interest.

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Heathbar (September 10, 2010)

... or my connection. I can't remember which happened first.

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hooverstreet (September 10, 2010)

Does it say anywhere how much money they are trying to squeeze out of the band? I can't imagine them having a lot to give.

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Dante3000 (rich) (September 10, 2010)

No clue, but I'd imagine it's way more than the band has.

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veganboyjosh (September 10, 2010)

it sounds from the summary--can't be bothered to rtfa--that there may be more going on here than Variety just saying "we told them to stop using our logo but the internet reported on it and now we're gonna sue them"

specifically, the line about breach of contract. i'm no lawyer (i do enjoy some matlock, however) but that seems like a different can of worms than just simple copyright or trademark infringement. sure, it has to do with the logo being used, but i'm getting the feeling that this new lawsuit is more about the Vandals not abiding by what was agreed to in the first suit.

again, if someone else wants to find out for sure, i'll gladly be wrong. major media outlets have been known to do dumber things before, and they'll likely do them again.

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bastard_squad (September 10, 2010)

"rtfa"...Read The Fucking Article?

Abbreviations make everything easier...unless I'm stupid and don't know what the abbreviation is.

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veganboyjosh (September 10, 2010)

you got it.

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bastard_squad (September 10, 2010)

We should hug.

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xchemicalx (September 10, 2010)

No it goes like this:

Variety: Stop using our logo and make sure that everyone who you have provided with the logo stops using it too.
Vandals: OK. We'll provide new artwork.
Variety: We saw you using our logo on www.websiteA.com
Vandals: But we gave them the new artwork. It's not our fault they decided not to use it.
Variety: Muahahahaha give us money!

Sad thing is Variety is (legally) in the right. The bottom line is that the Vandals were found to be infringing upon their intellectual property. If that infringement is still available online, despite whatever steps I'm sure the Vandals have taken, everything stems from the fact that in the eyes of the law, the Vandals were in the wrong to begin with and generated and distributed this work and it's their responsibility if this

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veganboyjosh (September 10, 2010)

i dunno. i mean, when the logo shows up here:

http://www.billboard.com/news#/search/vandals

i dunno what they're supposed to do.

could U@ still go after negativland for this:?

http://bit.ly/9TMxci

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veganboyjosh (September 10, 2010)

U2. could U2 go after them? stupid shift key.

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veganboyjosh (September 10, 2010)

in the billboard article--i just read it, my curiosity got the better of me--the attorney for Variety claims that the old logo was featured on Kung-Fu's website AFTER the cease and desist agreement was reached.

having dabbled in some web design, and understanding a little bit about how this stuff works, i'm wondering if the offending image wasn't posted somewhere obscure, not on the main page for that album, or in a slideshow, or something else that the band/the webmaster forgot about. i could totally believe that.

i don't think it's a case of it being on completely unrelated websites.

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Since94 (September 10, 2010)

Warren from The Vandals isn't very tanned!

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JayTee (September 10, 2010)

Honk! Honk!

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hey_ska (September 11, 2010)

Your're ska, skank your way right to lockjaw.

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dlangl4 (September 10, 2010)

Learning how to try this case on his own is going to work just as well as if he were to try building an X Wing on his own.

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veganboyjosh (September 10, 2010)

http://blog.thehobbyguy.tv/2007/10/15/x-wing/

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bastard_squad (September 10, 2010)

Did you see the end result? Glad those guys weren't the engineers behind the Death Star raid.

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veganboyjosh (September 10, 2010)

i like the half-hearted effort from the parachute. it's like it was sleeping or watching the simpsons when the launch happened, and caught off guard.

next time maybe they'll use more force and less cardboard and Elmer's glue.

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bastard_squad (September 10, 2010)

Yeah, that really funny. 'I'm supposed to be where?"

I wish I were sleeping or watching The Simpsons.

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jawbreakersuckssucks (September 10, 2010)

Of course they are being sued in a Delaware court; Variety is a Delaware registered business!

Where was Escalante Esquire's legal sense when he decided to manipulate the Variety logo in the first place?

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veganboyjosh (September 10, 2010)

Delaware?

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bastard_squad (September 10, 2010)

It was the first state. I'm surprised you haven't heard of it.

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jawbreakersuckssucks (September 10, 2010)

Zing!

Delaware has the most thorough incorporation statute in the nation. Most companies are incorporated there but need not be located there.

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hooverstreet (September 10, 2010)

Wouldn't a lawyer be familiar with trademark laws? It sounds like they went with the parody defense but it didn't work.

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Since94 (September 10, 2010)

I used to have a t-shirt back in highschool that had the Kraft logo and said "KRAP"
I wonder if they ever got sued....

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drunkwithpower (September 10, 2010)

Reed Elsevier is going down the tubes, I bet they go bancrupt and this falls apart before it gets to and court

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Michael_Berryman (September 10, 2010)

i had a Seaweed shirt that had the Motel 6 logo on it three times. it was the best shirt.

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jawbreakersuckssucks (September 10, 2010)

See also: Jawbreaker's Morton Salt shirt.

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bastard_squad (September 10, 2010)

Don't talk about that one.

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jawbreakersuckssucks (September 10, 2010)

But that's a good one! You don't like?

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bastard_squad (September 10, 2010)

It's still a sensitive subject. I still have my tour shirt.

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jawbreakersuckssucks (September 10, 2010)

As do I. As do I.

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bastard_squad (September 10, 2010)

Green with yellow ink?

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jawbreakersuckssucks (September 10, 2010)

Nah, I recall that one (the best looking one!) but I think it was a west coast or first edition. In '94, they had the blue with full color at a Chicago area show.

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bastard_squad (September 10, 2010)

Yeah, I've got the yellow. Didn't see the Full Color for years.

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jawbreakersuckssucks (September 10, 2010)

Was that the Unfun tour?

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bastard_squad (September 10, 2010)

No, just before 24 Hour.

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jawbreakersuckssucks (September 10, 2010)

Yep, we had the full color for that tour.

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bastard_squad (September 10, 2010)

I like mine, glad I didn't see the full color first. Just wish I didn't buy everything in XL back then.

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jawbreakersuckssucks (September 10, 2010)

Haha! That's the same problem I have with mine! I'm pissed I can't wear it without it looking like a nightgown.

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Cos (September 11, 2010)

you know its available again, right?

http://www.jawbreakermerch.com/products/jawbreaker-salt -girl-shirt-green

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theshred (September 10, 2010)

Same cover, different title? that work? Amazon thinks so... http://www.amazon.com/Hollywood-Potato-Chips-Vandals/dp/B000243E5 C/ref=sr_1_15?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1284148998&sr=8-15

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theshred (September 10, 2010)

why did i space it like that?

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bastard_squad (September 10, 2010)

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/b/b0/The_Vandals_ -_Hollywood_Potato_Chip_second_cover.jpg/200px-The_Vandals_-_Holl ywood_Potato_Chip_second_cover.jpg

That's the problem. They changed the cover but the internet won't let it go. Stupid internet out to get Joe. They should have blown up Skynet.

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dlangl4 (September 10, 2010)

A message to the internet when it becomes sentient: fuck you, ho ho ho.

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grinder68 (September 10, 2010)

I guess karma is a bitch, Joe is getting the karma from him fucking with the original Vandals on issue's of copyright etc.

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lookingforcorpses (September 10, 2010)

His former band mates and dozens of other punk bands he's bullied and threatened throughout the years. I hope they get this dude for his personal assets, too.

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gotitogo (September 10, 2010)

Joe should know the adage amongst lawyers that a lawyer who represents himself has a fool for a client. i know the fees suck, but joe, get a lawyer if at all possible.

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lookingforcorpses (September 10, 2010)

Was thinking that, as well. His ego knows no boundaries.

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pufferfish (September 10, 2010)

He probably can't afford it. I'd be most worried about the fact that he's "learning how to do litigation."

Every lawyer knows that there are "book lawyers," and then there are "litigators."

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lookingforcorpses (September 13, 2010)

That may be part of it, but I'm sure he thinks he can handle it. Look at your last sentence; the fact he's even considering this shows massive hubris on his part.

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kylewagoner (September 10, 2010)

On the plus side, The Vandals are getting some publicity out of this!

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xherojuanax (September 10, 2010)

The only ones generating publicity are the people at Variety. They're either doing this to get attention, or they're completely oblivious of the fact that the Vandals have such a relatively small presence in the music industry. They're acting as if the band is somehow capitalizing on the logo, but in reality, no one gives a shit.

It'd be like Purina suing Propagandhi.

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burntorangepeel (September 10, 2010)

I still don't understand how or why this wasn't safe under the parody laws. MAD magazine does it every month – Cheap!

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kevgren (September 11, 2010)

Right!

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kevgren (September 11, 2010)

This whole thing is bullshit. The logo is satirical, given the album title. If satire isn't protected, then we're in a shitload of trouble.

Really, though, this whole thing just smacks of a desperate attempt by an irrelevant magazine to stay relevant.

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lookingforcorpses (September 13, 2010)

Said this the last time this came up, Variety is FAR from irrelevant.

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LegalAsSheIsSpoke (October 17, 2010)

The lawsuit between the Vandals & Variety has been heating up-the Vandals are fighting to change the venue (where the suit is heard) from Delaware to California. While the Vandals are arguing this is a free speech issue, it's really a standard contract dispute: check out our rundown of what's really going on (legally speaking): http://lasisblog.com/2010/10/14/variety’s-logo-“vandalized”/