Punknews.org
Hot Water Music - The New What Next (Cover Artwork)

Hot Water Music

Hot Water Music: The New What NextThe New What Next (2004)
Epitaph Records

Reviewer Rating: 4
User Rating:


Contributed by: maverickScott
(others by this writer | submit your own)

I'll let you in on a little secret: Music reviewers, such as myself, tend to get albums prior to their street date, in hopes that we'll review said disc before it comes out to help build hype. Such was the case with the new Hot Water Music album, The New What Next - I've had a burn of it in a paper .
iTunes StoreAmazon


I'll let you in on a little secret: Music reviewers, such as myself, tend to get albums prior to their street date, in hopes that we'll review said disc before it comes out to help build hype. Such was the case with the new Hot Water Music album, The New What Next - I've had a burn of it in a paper sleeve from Epitaph since late July, and have listened to that CD-R more times than I can count. But here's where the kicker comes in: About two weeks ago, the finished version of the album shows up in my mailbox, and surprise of surprises, the album has been completely re-sequenced. Only one of the disc's 12 tracks remained in the same place (that song being "The End Of The Line," one of the best songs HWM have ever put to tape). The rest of the album was jumbled up beyond all recognition. To the normal consumer this makes no difference, because you never knew otherwise. But to those of us who are supposed to find some sort of emotional attachment with said album so we can be inspired enough to write about, it's difficult. Essentially, this album has an identity crisis.

For a band that has been around for the better part of the past decade, it seems strange that this identity crisis would even exist. There is obviously a Hot Water Music formula: The band has released over 130 songs to date, spanning six full-length albums as well as god-knows-how-many 7-inches, compilations, and the like. You don't have that kind of output without developing some sort of song guide. In HWM's case, it's two singers singing as gruff and unintelligible as possible, yet retaining an inherent sense of melody behind the craziest-and tightest-rhythm section in punk rock. Yet, on The New What Next, the dual vocals are virtually non-existant. The crazy rhythmic patterns are reduced to merely drum fills here and there. And the words? I can understand every single one of them. And let's not even talk about the use of falsetto on "There Are Already Roses." If I were Hot Water Music, I'd be having an identity crisis, too--I'd be leaving the studio wondering if we just made our worst album to date or the one that will define our career.

Well, the answer is neither, but leaning strongly towards the latter. TNWN showcases the band's restraint--something sorely lacking on previous releases. Fingerpointing singalongs were a dime a dozen on Fuel For The Hate Game and No Division, but not so much here. instead, the band really only lashes out on "The End Of The Line," "This Early Grave" and "Keep It Together;" unarguably, the album's three best tracks. For the other nine, singers Chuck Regan and Chris Wollard display their best melodicism in their careers. Unfortunately, that seems to mean that the reigns have been pulled in on bassist Jason Black and drummer George Rebelo. Tracks like "My Little Monkey Wrench" or "Bottomless Seas," while strong in their own rights, would benefit from the rhythm section not being so tight. There's no room for error, and thus, no room for experimentation and creative development.

Further compounding the whole thing is the damn re-sequencing. It's rather unnerving to become familiar with an album one way, then have it be completely changed without your consent. While realistically, I should have no say in how a band's album flows, it's still troubling to my ears. And upon comparing the two different versions of TNWN, I actually can't decide which I like more, because both make sense at points, and both falter at points (like the lack of a strong closing song; the original version used "There Are Already Roses" and the retail copy taps "Giver" for duty). The one advantage that the new sequence seems to have over the old is that it's almost broken up into sides one and two, like an LP -- tracks one through six are a separate entity from seven through twelve, and this is even made clear on the back cover of the album itself. As good as "Keep It Together" was as an opener, it's even more powerful if you imagine hearing it as you drop the needle on the b-side of the record.

So essentially, Hot Water Music are at a crossroads. These are some of the best songs they've ever released; filler doesn't exist in this 41-minute span. But being concise seemed to also mean being more professional; no flubbed notes, no weird vocals, no raw energy that permeated the band's earlier discs. Even still, it's the band's strongest effort since No Division, and in their top three records overall. If old-time fans like myself can get over HWM's identity crisis and just keep enjoying the ride, we'll all be rewarded.

MP3s
The End Of The Line
All Heads Down

 

 
People who liked this also liked:
Hot Water Music - CautionThe Lawrence Arms - Oh! Calcutta!Hot Water Music - No DivisionHot Water Music - A Flight and a CrashAgainst Me! - is Reinventing Axl RoseThe Lawrence Arms - The Greatest Story Ever ToldAgainst Me! - As The Eternal CowboyHot Water Music - Fuel For The Hate GameAlkaline Trio - GoddamnitJawbreaker - Dear You

Please login or register to post comments.What are the benefits of having a Punknews.org account?
  • Share your opinion by posting comments on the stories that interest you
  • Rate music and bands and help shape the weekly top ten
  • Let Punknews.org use your ratings to help you find bands and albums you might like
  • Customize features on the site to get the news the way you want.
Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not respon sible for them in any way. Seriously.
commie1848 (September 29, 2012)

Obviously not Caution, but it's decent.

bakedtoast (February 10, 2011)

Drums are surprisingly boring I love HWM but where's George's nasty beats and tempo changes. Still a good album though.

keithus (November 3, 2009)

This is very underrated album. A lot of longtime HWM fans consider it their worst album, but you can't compare this to their early work. You just have to take it for what it is. If you listened to this and then "Fuel for the Hate Game" they almost sound like 2 different bands.

Poison, The End of the Line, All Heads Down, Giver, Already Roses and Keep it Together all rank up there with my favorite HWM songs.

i-hate-winnipeg (November 23, 2007)

this album is DAMN good, but deffinately not my favorite. probably the worst of their Epitaph releases, but also better than some other things they've released... but i still dunno why everyone hates Finding the Rhythms... i mean, Chris' vocals on it weren't that great, but that's about it! i dunno. i'm rambling...

The_Wayfarer (January 19, 2007)

This was probably their wost album in my opinion... it just didn't have enough spirit for me.

chickswithdicks (August 20, 2006)

i also had an advance of this and thought it was alright, but i really enjoy the re-sequenced retail version more.

david_arquette (March 28, 2006)

After a year and a half with this album, I now think it's by far their best Epitaph release.

Anonymous (February 19, 2005)

It's not that this is an especially bad record, but it just doesn't compare with most of their previous albums. Fuel For The Hate Game is the best album I've ever had. The vocals are at their roughest here, but the dual guitars cannot be beaten. The energy that record gives is awesome. From there the energy has drained away some. There were lots of filler tracks on their last two records, although Caution had its moments, but I never saw this coming, not the sounds, the new artwork, nothing. So many tracks on The New What Next just don't seem to work. Giver was a pretty solid track, but it was the last one, and it seemed out of place. Hopefully their next record will be as good as I know they can be, because if they continue to go in this vein it would be a waste and a damned shame. Good music is hard to come by, especially in England.

Does anyone know if the Home/Last Goodbyes single will get onto a CD of some sort? I don't have a vinyl player and neither does anyone else.

Anonymous (December 13, 2004)

Simply amazing. I've been a fan for years, and I can't say this is better or worse than any of their old works (Fuel for the Hate Game for instance). It's just different. It's really nothing like the old stuff. I loved the old stuff. And I love this new stuff too. You kind of have to think of it as two seprate bands. The OLD HWM and the NEW HWM. Those who don't get it, probably just aren't listening to it in the right way. When I first listened to HWM, I just thought, "eh". But the more I listened to it, the more I started to hear the genius in the music. The intricacies in the guitar work, the poetic lyrics, and the way they present it is a one in a million occurance in today's scene. And for the last time, HWM is NOT emo. Nobody can even define emo, and whatever the fuck it was, it died a while ago. HWM is just good music. Leave it at that.

Piebalding (November 15, 2004)

Wow... That's really all I should have to say but...
I've heard some people comparing this album to Jawbreaker's "Dear You" and I can see where they pull that reference from. The glossy sheen on this album is begging for radio play and some of this album is radio-friendly. Fortunately, Hot Water Music did not have that in mind when they recorded this album. Jason Black and George Rebelo continue to make themselves known as one of the best rhythm sections in punk today while Chuck Ragan and Chris Wollard's guitars are nothing short of amazing. I could call this the album of the year on the merit of "Keep It Together" alone, but the entire album is solid and in my opinion the best of all their albums(and I've listened to all of their actually full-lengths).

Anonymous (October 28, 2004)

continued from b4 also 'there are already roses' chorus sounds like it was cut off 'there are already roses on the grave..................'

Anonymous (October 28, 2004)

This album was decent, yet I still don't have that same feeling I did after listening to caution. Although true in most cases, I really don't like it when people like to think that the first album from any band is automatically their best. Although 'Forever and Counting' is a terrific album with songs like 'better sense, just don't, and position' being my favorites. Hot Water Music seemed to find themselves on 'Caution.' Where up and down the cd were all great songs that flowed on to give you that ultimate great feeling at the end. Although, this cd does have it's high points with 'end of the line, there are already roses, and giver.' The rest just seem to be a jumbled mess. Also, 'there are already roses'

Anonymous (October 25, 2004)

why do different sites (epitaph, amazon, etc) list the tracklisting in different orders? is there diff. order released CDs or are some sites just retarded?

Anonymous (October 19, 2004)

I don't know what's wrong with me, but I just can't seem to get into this band...

Anonymous (October 13, 2004)

Not bad, after a couple of listens I still rate Caution higher, hopes it grows on me

-Strewtho.

Anonymous (October 10, 2004)

A solid release. But not the most memorable record by these upstanding gentlemen. But a good listen, nonetheless.

-ObeyYourParents

fritobandito (October 9, 2004)

I thought it was a decent album. It does sound really nice, but I just can't get over how much they just don't sound like THEM anymore. I don't want this super-melodic nonsense, I want my old No Division HWM back. It's like when they hit Epitaph, all the raw energy vanished. You can actually see the progression through A Flight and A Crash before it peaks and levels out on Caution and The New What's Next.

Meh. All in all I'm pretty disappointed. It's one of those albums that would be a great album if you forgot what band made it, y'know?

Anonymous (October 3, 2004)

This Band saved my life as well. I love what this band stands for. THis record is alright. Of course there's better...*cough* Forever and Counting *cough*...but it's a great band, great intelligent lyrics...bands like this, they just don't come up anymore. The only band I can think of that would even come close is A Wilhelm Scream. Those two bands are the only bright signs of hope in this dismal dilluted genre.

Ryan Fabian

Anonymous (October 2, 2004)

Better than Caution for sure.

Anonymous (October 1, 2004)

"oh and by the way, the new Sum 41 single "We're All to Blame" is the best song they've ever made... and yes I hated their last 2 albums."

That´s not saying much...

Not-To-Regret (September 30, 2004)

oh and by the way, the new Sum 41 single "We're All to Blame" is the best song they've ever made... and yes I hated their last 2 albums.

Not-To-Regret (September 30, 2004)

"Its like i always say, an average HWM or Strung out song is still above average when compared to most current bands."

This guy was right...

I'll admit I wasn't immediately impressed with "the new what next" upon my first listen but with gradual listens this album is growing on me... and to me that's what makes for great albums... ones that don't have immediately catchy hooks or choruses or whatever.
I'm sick of all the strung out bashing by the age 25 crowd who look down upon metal-punk bands just because they have a large following. Some bands simply have large followings because their music is FUCKING GOOD, is that so hard to understand? it doesn't mean they're trying to sell out or "fool kids into liking them"... etc...

Anonymous (September 30, 2004)

simple plan,good charlotte and sum 41.
oh hell yeah gotta get those,hopefully the good charlotte cd will include a poster of benji.

Anonymous (September 30, 2004)

"Jimmy eat world .already downloaded it´s good
strung out .perhaps
Me first and the gg .your joking right?!
maybe straylight run .no way jose
blood brothers.think i´ll pass

tom waits.not my cup of tea"

oh shit i forgot to list these.

new simple plan, good charlotte and sum 41 too dude

dazed (September 30, 2004)

argh, gotta get this.

Anonymous (September 30, 2004)

review the album and the songs, i really don't care about the sequence of the songs. get over it, dork.

Anonymous (September 30, 2004)

Jimmy eat world .already downloaded it´s good
strung out .perhaps
Me first and the gg .your joking right?!
maybe straylight run .no way jose
blood brothers.think i´ll pass

tom waits.not my cup of tea

Anonymous (September 30, 2004)

"it´s sad that these guys, green day and flogging molly has released their records cause what the hell is there to look forward too now!?
"

Jimmy eat world, strung out, Me first and the gg, maybe straylight run, blood brothers...

Anonymous (September 29, 2004)

Strung Out and Tom Waits, moron.

-Chinatown

Anonymous (September 29, 2004)

it´s sad that these guys, green day and flogging molly has released their records cause what the hell is there to look forward too now!?

Anonymous (September 29, 2004)

i dont care if this album sucks or not! everyone is missing the point. if your looking for music to - think about your girl, drive around windows down, show off, be punk, your looking in the wrong direction. this band saved my life, hands down. they fucking saved my life. so for that, i thank them, by buying every god damn thing they put out. if a band can do that......they are right on. its all in the words girls and boys! oh...forget about minor threat (the guy with the stupid post down a few), at least listen to rites of spring or fugazi. come on. KIDS THESE DAYS????

Anonymous (September 29, 2004)

it´s kinda funny that "the end of the line" has the same intro as blink 182´s "feeling this"...

Anonymous (September 29, 2004)

I think peoples opinion of HWM changes based on when they got into them. I didnt' get into them until 2000, and 'a flight...' was the first cd of theirs i got. Then I got "caution" then "no division". I like "no division" the least out of those 3...but people that got into them in the 90's tend to think otherwise.

this album is still an 8.5

paul

soulbleed (September 29, 2004)

oh, and yea, this band doesn't rip off alkaline trio OR thursday. and yes, they've matured. you can't make the same album 12 times. god forbid they grow up.

soulbleed (September 29, 2004)

I never thought No Division was their best. Fuel for the Hate Game and Caution always ruled the school for me .. this album is just Caution, part 2. Good for them.

Anonymous (September 29, 2004)

This is their ninth album. EP/7" comps should still count as full-lengths, since each one has its own distinct sound.

Finding the Rythms
Fuel for the Hate Game
Neverender
No Division
Live at the Hardback
Forever and Counting
A Flight and a Crash
Caution
The New What Next

Anonymous (September 28, 2004)

ha-ha-ha-ha-ha! this band is so horrible, go listen to minor threat

Big_Guy (September 28, 2004)

"i dont know, i think this band rips off alkaine trio too much"

Dude, I hope you are kidding, I love Alk 3 as much as the next guy buy HWM was around 5-6 years before the trio.

And they are better

Anonymous (September 28, 2004)

i dont know, i think this band rips off alkaine trio too much

maverick (September 28, 2004)

The band doesn't consider Finding The Rhythms a "real" album since it grew out of demos and a 7". They consider their first true album Fuel For The Hate Game.

-Scott

Anonymous (September 28, 2004)

to the guy at the top who wasn't sure if he was going to see Strung Out or Hot Water Music...if there was ever a question in your little pop riffed mind please surrender any and all HWM materials on your person. Wake up honkey, Strung Out suck, like there was ever a contest?!!?!?

Anonymous (September 28, 2004)

"Does Under Everything sound alot like a little bit mellower version of Alright For Now?"

Yea, but 'under everything' is waay better IMO.

I thought this was their seventh too...

fuel for the hate game
finding the riddims
forever and counting
no division
flight and crash
caution
the new what next

thats seven...did i fuck up?

fuckin hwm is playing the same night as strung out in pgh...11/9

which would you go to ? (right now i'm leaning towards strung out)

Anonymous (September 28, 2004)

"When Scott said that they could stand to not be so tight, I almost fell off my seat. Are you fucking for real?

How dare you be excellent musicians who can execute your craft flawlessly! Fuck up some more! Sound shittier! Maybe make a, to steal a quote, " meandering, sloppy, semi-competent heap of nothing much in particular" like The Libertines."

I was totally cheering you on until you brought the libertines into it. cmon man 'music when the lights go out' and 'can't stand me now' are two of the best songs i've heard all year.

this album PW3nS all of you btw fyi imo omg gay!

Anonymous (September 28, 2004)

When Scott said that they could stand to not be so tight, I almost fell off my seat. Are you fucking for real?

How dare you be excellent musicians who can execute your craft flawlessly! Fuck up some more! Sound shittier! Maybe make a, to steal a quote, " meandering, sloppy, semi-competent heap of nothing much in particular" like The Libertines.

Anonymous (September 28, 2004)

Change that, not sound's like, but remind you of...

Anonymous (September 28, 2004)

Does Under Everything sound alot like a little bit mellower version of Alright For Now?

Anonymous (September 28, 2004)

DEAR BRETT GUREWITZ:

Advise your clients that "Under Everything" is an ideal single.
The Much Loud audience would eat it up

Barkley"Much Loud is a metal/punk video channel"Barkster

boldredletters (September 28, 2004)

neverender isn't technically a full length... it's a collection.

Anonymous (September 28, 2004)

mine has a sticker on it... stating it's their sixth full length... i thought it was their seventh?

boldredletters (September 28, 2004)

i agree with the guy a few posts down. if anything, the stuff on this record sounds like "Finding the Rhythm." And, personally, after seeing them live, "Giver" is probably my favorite track - the chorus is just unfuckwithable.

Give this one a chance - nod your head and close your eyes a little.

Anonymous (September 27, 2004)

Well said (person below me, twice).
At the same time, sometimes people fall in love with a band for their certain sound at one given point, and that music really means something to them. Sometimes it's hard to adjust to anything different (even if the band is growing and maturing).

Anonymous (September 27, 2004)

oops. i spelled gainesville wrong. i knew that.

Anonymous (September 27, 2004)

this review, and 90% of the comments are upsetting. how many of you are in touring bands? how many of you have ever written and recorded an album? it actually offends me when people always mention their previous albums, because it doesn't really have anything to do with the fact that they just released a new one. an amazing album that a majority of you probably listened to less than five times. i'm going to tell you a little secret (kind of like the one about reviewers being special and recieving albums before "common people"), the reason anything before "a flight and a crash" sounds like that, is because they didn't have any money! luckily for music fans, they have had the chance to make records like "caution", and "the new what next". maybe if it was recorded in someone's bathroom in gainsville, and they used tin cans for drums, some of you would enjoy it more. i honestly believe that "the new what next" has the most in common with some of their earlier releases. "keep it together" could have easily been on "forever and counting" and "the end of the line" screams the earlier hot water sound, they've just gotten a lot better at writing songs and making albums. as for the review, i don't think anyone cares about you're "emotional attatchment" to an old sequence, because they obviously weren't satisfied with it. i think that was a very odd topic to base an entire review on. on a personal note i'm a little suprised that there wasn't really any mention of "under everything". it's one of the best songs i have ever heard. i guess my point is, next time any of you put you're hearts and souls into something, i hope somebody behind you is telling you you're doing it all wrong.

Anonymous (September 27, 2004)

I liked it better when it was called Guns N' Roses

Anonymous (September 27, 2004)

Ever notice how most HWM fans, I mean no-doubt, balls-out HWM fans are very quick to defend the band? If my friend says that he doesn't like HWM, I get upset.

Anonymous (September 27, 2004)

HWM is OG Gainesville emocore.

Anonymous (September 27, 2004)

i'll admit, i had this record on my computer long before it came out. I like it, i don't think its the "must have" record that Jason Black wants everyone to think it is, but it kicks A Flight and A Crash in the balls for sure.

I'm glad HWM got signed up to a bigger label and they can make a living doing this because I love this band. But missing ever since Epitaph is that rough recording sound and creative passion that made me think the band looked at each other and said "do we eat this month or do we go into the studio?" I think they are still passionate about what they do, but the music isn't what it used to be. I allow bands to grow and change, but like Scott i miss the gruff dual vocals and the intense bass fills and crazy drumming.

i know there will never be another Fuel, or Forever and Coutning . . . but we can all hope can't we?

Anonymous (September 27, 2004)

gotta go ahead and disagree w/ your review. I never heard the first sequencing, so i am unbiased.

ink & lead is one of their best songs to date, very melodic and shows an unabashed emotional (not emo though fags) side to chuck. great song.

poison and end of the line are two great opening tracks.

Bottomless seas is like nothing they've ever done, and is great

giver is a great sing along anthem, and a perfect closer.

'under everything' is a great HWM epic, very powerful

'already roses' has agreat hook to it

honestly, 'keep it together' is one of the more generic songs on the album IMO. Glad its not the opener.

I'd say I like caution slightly more than this, but this is still better than 'flight and crash' and certainly better than most albums out there in general.

Its like i always say, an average HWM or Strung out song is still above average when compared to most current bands.

8.5/10

Anonymous (September 27, 2004)

horrible horrible horrible. What happened to the band I once loved. gone is that perfect bass sound, sludgy guitar, shoted vocals. they just sound like a bog standard band now.

Anonymous (September 27, 2004)

hot water is good emo, but not the best punk band out there."

You sir read too much Alternative Press (Sorry Scott)

FOR FUCK SAKES YOU CANNOT CATEGORIZE MUSIC WITH THESE INSIDIOUS "TAGS" DO YOU REMEMBER CALLING PEARL JAM A GRUNGE BAND IN 1992? ONLY TOO FIND OUT THAT THEY ARE ESSENTIALLY A ROCK AND ROLL BAND (A TERM THAT HAS BEEN AROUND FOR AT LEAST 40 years thus making it acceptable to use to me STOP DEVULGING YOUR OPINION FROM OUTSIDE SOURCES! AHHHHHH

Barkley

bemused (September 26, 2004)

I love how HWM records grow on you over time. It was a good idea waiting a couple of months to review this thing, so you could best describe it. I'm realling getting into this now, and yes, there is no filler

-chris-

Anonymous (September 26, 2004)

"I think Guttermouth are a better band"

You sir, are an ass.

Guttermouth have gone so far fuckind downhill in terms of music, it's not even funny anymore.

Anonymous (September 26, 2004)

That was a pretty bad review. It seemed like he didn't like the album at all. It wasn't until I read the last paragraph that he seemed to say it was good.

Anonymous (September 26, 2004)

Shyster's drummer played in Diesel Boy?
Better off staying in Shyster... "Say Uncle" is an unbelievable album.
You do have to admit it was more fun to see them play back in '98 than today. 30 people in the crowd as opposed to 300 , half of those just seeing them because they're on Epitaph.
Haha, Radon... all I still have from them is the "Back To Donut" No Idea comp... nice call though!

Anonymous (September 26, 2004)

I think Guttermouth are a better band

Anonymous (September 26, 2004)

This album rocks, it's rock. It's not really punk, it's not hardcore, it's not "emo." It's straight forward rock. One of my favorite HWM releases. It might be different than all their other stuff, but I really don't think that's a bad thing.

Anonymous (September 26, 2004)

shyster's drummer went on to play with deisel boy. i think they ended with that.

this record is great. hwm does not disappoint. ps- stop using the term 'emo,' forever and counting is NOT their best record and radon was better than hot water anyway.

Anonymous (September 26, 2004)

Whatever happened to that band Shyster these guys used to play with? They were from Orlando, I think.

Anonymous (September 26, 2004)

this band makes me yawn

Anonymous (September 26, 2004)

hot water is good emo, but not the best punk band out there.

Anonymous (September 26, 2004)

kiddies who likes nu metal emo faggot bands like most of the people here might want to say these guys made a boring album.

FUCK OFF. you're what? 15? 16?
quit thinking your "the used" album is a masterpiece...

Hot Water Music is and will always be the best punk rock band on this planet...

they changed their sound, and its amazing.
NEW BANDS OUT THERE DRESS LIKE DRAGQUEENS...

Dude_Poverty (September 26, 2004)

I miss Hot Water Music.

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

Make Fun of me all you want but you can never rob me of my love for this album.

Barkley

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

I agree with the fellas below: Forever and Counting was their apex album.

Actually, I haven't bought another HWM album since then...

Sometimes it's good to stay in the late 90's. Back when these guys played basement shows all over the southeast.

Not-To-Regret (September 25, 2004)

Ebb and Flow... amazing!

Hot Water Music and Bouncing Souls live in vancouver at "dicks on dicks" in 2003 was a fucking amazing show!

maverick (September 25, 2004)

Wait... So, Pete from the Bouncing Souls plays a guitar solo on the song that lyrically refrences a Bouncing Souls song?

I am completely and utterly lost.

-Scott

Big_Guy (September 25, 2004)

"One more thing I like about "Giver" - the Bouncing Souls homage ("Here we go, here we go, here we gooo!!") I guess all that touring they did together affected them."

i believe the pete from the souls plays a guitar solo on this album"

As a matter of fact the Pete plays a solo on that exact song

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

"One more thing I like about "Giver" - the Bouncing Souls homage ("Here we go, here we go, here we gooo!!") I guess all that touring they did together affected them."

i believe the pete from the souls plays a guitar solo on this album

Big_Guy (September 25, 2004)

I heard this twice in a row and the second time was exponentially better

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

"THIS ALBUM TAKES A WHILE TO SINK IN....but when it does WATCH THE FUCK OUT!"

"why? is it like scabies?"

funniest thing i have read in quite some time, i tip my hat to you good sir.

cdogg (September 25, 2004)

One more thing I like about "Giver" - the Bouncing Souls homage ("Here we go, here we go, here we gooo!!") I guess all that touring they did together affected them.

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

"THIS ALBUM TAKES A WHILE TO SINK IN....but when it does WATCH THE FUCK OUT!"

why? is it like scabies?

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

I found that upon first hearing the song "under everything" the chorus almost seems to obvious. But wait....after letting this album mature and reach your inner psyche, the aforementioned song and the remaining album are absolutely fucking brilliant. Even that Ballad where Ragen is singing "hold on" is great.

Barkley"Saw Cave In Last Night"Barkster

P.s Cave In played some of that new leaked demo material and it was mind blowing

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

THIS ALBUM TAKES A WHILE TO SINK IN....but when it does WATCH THE FUCK OUT!

Barkley"Album of the Year"Barkster

cdogg (September 25, 2004)

"...and both falter at points (like the lack of a strong closing song; the original version used "There Are Already Roses" and the retail copy taps "Giver" for duty)."

I think "Giver" is a great way to end the album, and from looking at some of the comments it appears many agree with me. This record is growing on me; it's not up to the quality level of "Caution" , but I like it more with every listen.

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

"There's no room for error, and thus, no room for experimentation and creative development."

You're a total douche. give up.

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

Not as great as "Caution", but still good. This IS a different, more melodic HWM. Not bad, not unidentifiable, but still great.

"All Hands Down" is a great song, this hasn't left the stereo all week.

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

yawn

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

gentlement don't ask questions, they just keep quiet, and pay attention

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

I picked this up a few days ago and it hasnt left my CD player. I absolutely love this record and I know when they tour this fall the songs will sound even better in a live setting. Thats where the true heart lies in HWM, their live performance.

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

Fuel for the Hate Game is absolutely HWM's best.

220 Years, Rock Singer... it's all good.

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

the main issue with this cd is the coverart.

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

"This record fucking sucks. Guitar tones and riffs borrowed from Thursday. Go listen to Fuel for the Hate Game, it's their only good one.

-Jesse"

That kid only listens to that cd cause the one song was on Tony Hawk.

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

one of THEIR best 3 you fool

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

so how does the reviewer tell us how bad this cd is compared to old hwm, but then go on to say its one of the TOP 3 CDS? that's an atrocity.

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

oh shit bearded poppunk with a singer that sounds like he is about to cough up his lungs. this shit sounds all the same. give em poopdick.

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

the beginning of the album reminds me of bad religion. but only for a second.

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

like who?

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

I think other bands are doing the HWM sound better these days.

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

Dude, how many times do we have to do this? I agree, Forever & Counting is BY FAR their best album. High five, gringos!

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

Asshole below tells the world h d/ls mp3s on irc

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

The best songs on here are "Floor" and "Western Grace."

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

How the fuck did Tsunami Bomb get a higher rating than this?!

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

I have had it for 2 months too. This was the original order. Totally used to it too, and must say I prefer it. Reprogramme the CD and see what you think. For me if Caution was a double album, this would be like the second record. It just sounds so like it, but a bit more laid back.

01-hot_water_music-keep_it_together-tbk.mp3
02-hot_wate r_music-the_end_of_the_line-tbk.mp3
03-hot_water_music-bottomles s_seas-tbk.mp3
04-hot_water_music-all_heads_down-tbk.mp3
05-hot _water_music-the_ebb_and_flow-tbk.mp3
06-hot_water_music-my_litt le_monkey_wrench-tbk.mp3
7-hot_water_music-under_everything-tbk. mp3
8-hot_water_music-ink_and_lead-tbk.mp3
09-hot_water_music-p oison-tbk.mp3
10-hot_water_music-this_early_grave-tbk.mp3
11-ho t_water_music-giver-tbk.mp3
12-hot_water_music-there_are_already _roses-tbk.mp3

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

am i the only person here who thinks forever and counting is their best album?

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

they're so boring boring boring

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

what was the original track listing?

Cos (September 25, 2004)

Yeah, I'm not too jazzed on this one either. Maybe they've just progressed and I'm not digging/getting it. Honestly, "The New What Next" just bored me. Better luck next time..

--Cos

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

i love this album and it just gets better and better. i did like the original track list better, i felt that it put me in a certain mood and kept me there the entire time, where the new tracklist seems choppier. either way, an amazing album. even ebb & flow...i love that song.

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

i thought the river bed was small brown bike's best record, and I don't miss HWM's old records. I've liked them all so far, with no division being my favorite. While I did think the epitaph albums had some filler, I still thought they were solid records.

This is the first one i've been disappointed with, and i came into it having been suprised, in a good way, with the comp. tracks they put out right before this (kill the night and Seein' Diamonds). There are some good tracks, but the guitar line in 'keep it together' is just inferior, its cardboard sugar. That, and too much repitition, I don't know how this transitions from their past records, even including the epitaph ones.

However, it has kept me through a few listens, and It's not a waste, I still look forward to there next record, every band can't please everyone each record, this is just there dud for me.

Wyzo

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

This record fucking sucks. Guitar tones and riffs borrowed from Thursday. Go listen to Fuel for the Hate Game, it's their only good one.

-Jesse

inagreendase (September 25, 2004)

anyway, dont buy this thing unless you want to feel a little betrayed, or something.

I'm sure most people who buy this will feel something, but it sure as hell won't be betrayal.

pwfanatic (September 25, 2004)

this album is also awesome.

Anonymous (September 25, 2004)

this is probably hot water musics worst album. i would liken it to that river bed album, that small brown bike made last year. its a "get famous on college rock stations" album. the promotions company that sends it to college stations says that they have decided that "they have something to say, and like a modern day husker du, have decided to make it heard", but all they did was make it sucky. that may sound like im saying that husker du is sucky, but they arent, or werent or whatever. what im saying is that they made a bad indy rock album, when they could be making great punk albums. theres no chaos here, theres no "heartfeltness". i dont know, im not against progression, ever, but i am against change to reach a slightly larger, insignificant market like college radio. maybe they shouldnt have been touring with fucking dashboard confessional and the get up kids, or whoever they were out with. anyway, dont buy this thing unless you want to feel a little betrayed, or something.

maverick (September 24, 2004)

"filler doesn't exist"
"crazy rhythmic patterns are reduced to merely drum fills here and there"
Sounds like filler to me?

Dude, you're fucking stupid.

-Scott

inagreendase (September 24, 2004)

"The End of the Line" is indeed an absoloutely massive track. Year-end mixtape qualifying. Hell, lifetime-end mixtape qualifying (no pun intended). "My Little Monkey Wrench" and "Keep It Together" are probably my other two favorites.

But they still didn't solve the abrupt ending thing. They need a track that fades a lot more and doesn't contain full vocals several seconds before the end hits.

Anonymous (September 24, 2004)

This band pretty much got me into the underground music scene the better part of 7 years ago. I've loved all of the cd's they have put out ever since. This one just doesnt do it for me though. When a new HWM cd came out in the past, i'd listen non stop. Not this one though. It's not terrible...its just missing something, and that something is rather intangible. I'm really dissapointed with the rearrangement of the song order. I personally think poison is the worst HWM song i've ever heard...and they made it the first track? does anyone else hate that song?

Anonymous (September 24, 2004)

filler doesn't exist"
"crazy rhythmic patterns are reduced to merely drum fills here and there"
Sounds like filler to me?

hahahahahahahahaha... oh and hahahahaha

Anonymous (September 24, 2004)

Wow, this is a really consistent review.......

"no weird vocals"
"And let's not even talk about the use of falsetto on "There Are Already Roses"
Sounds like weird vocals to me?

"filler doesn't exist"
"crazy rhythmic patterns are reduced to merely drum fills here and there"
Sounds like filler to me?

"it's the band's strongest effort since No Division"
"These are some of the best songs they've ever released"
Even before No Division?

Also, the restructuring of the album is your problem and not a problem for the average listener. Bad review.

Anonymous (September 24, 2004)

Oh yeah, the comment below was me!

-notfeelingcreative

Anonymous (September 24, 2004)

Best HWM album since "no division"!

opivykid (September 24, 2004)

I really think they killed the cd with the new track listing. Keep It Together is an amazing song, and should've just stayed as the opening one. Bah, theres still some amazing songs on it, like "Giver", "There Are Already Roses", and, of course, "Keep It Together." "The Ebb and Flow" is an awfuil song though...

Anonymous (September 24, 2004)

I really like the album, I just can't decide how much I like it.. It probably won't get as much play for me as Fuel or No Division do.. it is definately a great CD tho.. All Heads Down (Track 3) brings the rock..

I do have to say tho, that the new sequencing of the songs makes the album flow much better then the original did. I was listening to a burnt copy for a while and was also surprised when i bought it..

thebouncingsoul (September 24, 2004)

great review scott...i actually think the re-tooled version of this album flows alot better than it did before, but i didnt really get all too attached to it until the last couple weeks...its a definate grower

"giver" and "this early grave" are two of the better songs they've ever recorded IMO

adam (September 24, 2004)

I knew you would do a better job reviewing this than I would Scott, thanks. This record is still rather fresh to me so I'm undecided how I'd rank it with their past work at this point.

I really love the song "This Early Grave." That much I know.

-adam

Exclusive Streams

Sponsored


Newest Reviews

Punknews.org Team

Other Places to Go