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Preview unreleased songs on the Rock Against Bush e-card

Contributed by Toby_at_Fat. Posted by adam on Thursday, April 8, 2004 at 11:55 PM (EDT)

From the fine folks at Fat Wreck Chords: Shit howdy. We've posted our e-card for the RAB comp and you can hear about 5 different sound samples from some of the unreleased songs on the comp. Descendents, Alkaline Trio, Anti-Flag, etc. Fun times, fun times. The thing's out 4/20, until then you'll have to settle for 35 second samples: e-card

Punk Voter (102 comments)

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Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way. Seriously.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

first..alkaline trio song is amazing

10+ Replies

Someone (April 9, 2004)

yeah it sounds pretty good.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

I agree.

lunchbox (April 9, 2004)

the alkaline trio is excellent

Someone (April 9, 2004)

they are almost as awesome as WEB JOURNALS!

Someone (April 9, 2004)

It sure as shit does!!

lieutenant (April 9, 2004)

Best "first" comment ever. I love the song. Matt's voice hits it perfectly. Of course, I may be biased as I'd admittedly have his child if I could, but whatever.

Someone (April 10, 2004)

"Of course, I may be biased as I'd admittedly have his child if I could, but whatever." Amen to that!

Someone (April 9, 2004)

fark yeeeaahhh!!!matt`s voice sounds like its recovered somewhat!

Someone (April 9, 2004)

but the new split is not.

lieutenant (April 9, 2004)

No way, this is some of the Trio's best work. Sadie is absolutely amazing, while the lines like "I'd kill for you and eat the flesh, give you the heart and burn the rest." from Fine Without You just make this album. Yeah, I don't know why I bother to try...

Someone (April 9, 2004)

how do i get it on irc?

Someone (April 9, 2004)

#punkwhore on EFNet

Someone (April 9, 2004)

you prove my point. What the hell kind of lyric is that? Trying too hard to be dark and it bothers me.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

get a kleenex and wipe that wax outta your ears then man! new trio is fucking awesome..those 6 song are better than good mourning ten fold!

Someone (April 9, 2004)

I'm pleased as piss!!!

Someone (April 9, 2004)

even bush lovers will rock out to this shit...

Someone (April 9, 2004)

is that the soviettes on the 4th track of the ecard? -hitlerbadzakgood

1+ Reply

Toby_at_Fat (April 9, 2004)

Why yes it is! An excellent guess.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

great cause, but it doesn't change the fact that anti-flag blows like moby dick.

2+ Replies

punky (April 9, 2004)

funny.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

and true.

lieutenant (April 9, 2004)

Who performs the female-fronted song?

3+ Replies

Someone (April 9, 2004)

Your mama.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

its the soviettes i do believe

Someone (April 9, 2004)

iwas going to ask the same thing

funkisdead (April 9, 2004)

you should post my news about the new deep elm street teams

1+ Reply

lieutenant (April 9, 2004)

Zing! Right?

Someone (April 9, 2004)

If I didn't have the strongest feeling that Fat Mike was doing this for money, I'd so buy this if for only the alk3, descendents, and strike anywhere songs... stupid morals. sweet kazaa.

6+ Replies

Someone (April 9, 2004)

Yeah, Fat Mike is probably just a big Bush supporter, pretending otherwise just to make money.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

Well, yea, you kind of need money if you plan on pushing a political cause passed the doorway and into reality. Come on now, man. You reek of cliche. -MATEO

Someone (April 9, 2004)

He has PLENTY of money... and on top of that...the money is coming IN from a political cause, he isn't raising money FOR a cause, but he's raising it FROM a cause. -Same Guy.

dazed (April 9, 2004)

He's not keeping any of the profit from this comp, it's ALL going to PACs that are anti-Bush from what I understand.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

the strike anywhere song isn't new though

Someone (April 9, 2004)

Mike started Punkvoter with $100,000 dollars of his own money. In addition, Fat is putting tons of effort and resources into the endeavor and all those employees get paid out of what would presumably be fat Mikes pocket. Every cent of profit from the CD goes to Punkvoter where it is spent on Anti-Bush attack ads and such. To me, that is a huge sacrifice on fat Mikes part. I think your cynicism is misplaced. Not liking the roster of bands I can well understand. But I have heard from a number of different sources that both Fat Wreck and Mike himself have totally sterling ethical reputations.

Someone (April 10, 2004)

well put, not only all that guy said I got a few words for you. NONE MORE BLACK LAWRENCE ARMS AGAINST ME! Barkley

Someone (April 9, 2004)

the rock against bush comp has an e-card... doesn't get any more punk than that

2+ Replies

Someone (April 10, 2004)

You are the one on the internet! How punk are you now? Fucking hypocrite...typical internet scene police bullshit, an e-card is intended to get the word out, and the word NEEDS to get out about this anti-Bush comp. Suck it, poser.

slippy (April 10, 2004)

what isnt punk rock about an e-card?

Someone (April 9, 2004)

has anyone seen that lillix (sp?) commercial where the lead singer is pushing some brand of contact lenses? that's some funny shit! -forrest law

2+ Replies

ShamRocknRoll (April 9, 2004)

i love how she acts like playing till 12 is no big deal but is actually tyring to make it look like a big deal. "yeah we played till liek 12" BIG FUCKING WHOP! I HAVENT BEEN TO A SHOW THAT DIDNT GO TO 12 YOU WHORE!

andrew13 (April 10, 2004)

she's decent of better... so i'd hit it...

Someone (April 9, 2004)

Punk Rock, Diversity, and the Gonzo Conservatives By Dave Smalley In 2004, punk rock fans don't have to all be the same. Sheep are the same. Lemmings are the same. But punk rock fans should never demand sameness, be it from the left or the right. A healthy democracy depends on a free thinking, engaged citizenry -- and a healthy punk rock scene should be the FIRST to welcome ideological diversity. I call punk rock conservatives gonzo conservatives. This is not your father's conservatism. Gonzo conservatives have done and seen things their fathers never could have imagined, and right alongside punks on the left. Gonzos are inked and scarred and concerned about problems in the world. They love the Bad Brains and the Sex Pistols, and grew up believing the very essential punk rock notion of "think for yourself." Some have been part of the punk rock scene for years, and helped it grow

show rest of commentPunk Rock, Diversity, and the Gonzo Conservatives By Dave Smalley In 2004, punk rock fans don't have to all be the same. Sheep are the same. Lemmings are the same. But punk rock fans should never demand sameness, be it from the left or the right. A healthy democracy depends on a free thinking, engaged citizenry -- and a healthy punk rock scene should be the FIRST to welcome ideological diversity. I call punk rock conservatives gonzo conservatives. This is not your father's conservatism. Gonzo conservatives have done and seen things their fathers never could have imagined, and right alongside punks on the left. Gonzos are inked and scarred and concerned about problems in the world. They love the Bad Brains and the Sex Pistols, and grew up believing the very essential punk rock notion of "think for yourself." Some have been part of the punk rock scene for years, and helped it grow. Some are new to the scene and discovering that punk's ideals can lead to more than one way streets. Many have been on the left at some point and become disillusioned with it, and started to believe that the other perspective just might have some good points. Gonzo conservatives see some people who claim to be punk rock fans wanting to enforce a "one-mindset" mentality -- precisely the opposite of what we fought for all these years. Some punk fans don't see how anyone can claim to be conservative and punk simultaneously -- whereas gonzo conservatives don't see how anyone can demand conformity and still claim to be punk. Demanding conformity is the essence of fascism (or communism, which, depending on what political model one uses, can be seen as one and the same). In 2004, there are a growing number of gonzo conservatives. They don't like being told they're supposed to think like everyone else. They are not sheep, to be herded by others who would dictate in our community. They are human beings, deserving of common decency and respect. Gonzo conservatives believe that punk rock is about being smart, and caring, and changing the world -- but only when and where it needs it. "Being punk" does not mean hating the world, or the president, just for the sake of it. If something is good, support it. There are more than enough problems in America and the world to work on without reflex demonization. Punk rock means seeing the problems in the world and fighting (which sometimes means, well, fighting) to make it better. And if there is some disagreement about what is bad in the world, so be it: Gonzo conservatives see world government as wrong -- it makes slaves out of human beings. The problem with the Taliban, the former Soviet Union, the Saddam Hussein regime, et al, is that they tried to contain the human spirit. And the human spirit cannot be contained. Not forever, anyway. It is for that reason there is opposition to those in our own country who seem to want us to give up our rights to a poorly run, monolithic United Nations bureaucracy. And there is support for those who want America to act in our own vital interests in the world -- together with others when we can, alone if the cause is just. Consensus where possible, but action where necessary. These are words for a nation to live by. Gonzo conservatives see unnecessary taxes as another danger to the nation, to be opposed. Income taxes did not exist in the United States until Abraham Lincoln forced them onto an unhappy public to finance a war. Still they remain, sapping the economic lifeblood of working families and the very economic engine itself -- and some in America continually want to raise them. Gonzo conservatives oppose tax hikes as oppressive and demeaning to the human spirit. They're surprised when they see some punk rock fans -- often the same punks who argue that the government is fucked, fascist, etc. -- supporting the party that favors giving more money to the government -- taken from the wages of millions of working Joes. Let's be truly a fair society, and let people keep as much as possible of the living that they work so hard to earn. Gonzo conservatives see racial quotas as an Orwellian twisting of good intentions. Not hiring someone because of their color? Hiring someone because of theirs? It's racist, and illogical. Imagine if "affirmative action" extended to one's favorite band. The Beatles were four white men. Should they have had to hire "someone of color" to fill a quota? How about if the Bad Brains had to hire a white person on drums? If racial quotas seem like a poor idea for a band, it's an even worse reason for someone getting admitted to medical school. Let's be truly a colorblind society, and let all people's talents shine, regardless of the color of their skin. Where there is discrimination, we must fight it -- but we must not make the remedy one of discrimination itself. Gonzo conservatives see the current state of public education in America as not just bad, but disastrous. Despite spending more per pupil than most other democracies, we come up short time and again in science, math and now computer programming competitions with other countries. The upper echelons of public education have been so co-opted and warped by politicized teacher's unions that millions of desperate parents of all colors and creeds are pulling their kids out, opting for private schools they can't afford, or home schooling. Statistically, very few politicians, including the ones of the "education party," send their kids to public schools. They must believe what so many are saying: too much dogma controlling the curriculum, too many schools filled with drugs and violence, with no discipline allowed, and a "teach to the bottom, never to the top" philosophy. Perhaps the most disturbing question: Why do the rich, mostly white politicians in the "education party" fight against school vouchers -- something that helps poor minority kids escape the chaos? Gonzo conservatives believe the true education party is the one fighting to make sure No Child is Left Behind. Real reforms, real results required. Gonzo conservatives know that there are thousands of excellent teachers out there -- but there are others who use their jobs to advance a political agenda over real learning. And that's wrong, and it has the potential of killing this country for the long-term. Let's be truly an educated society, one which teaches all points of views, but real history -- not try to use our teachers as ideological bullets in a dogmatic gun. When Harriet Tubman is given more ink than George Washington in the history books, there is a serious distortion of learning. Both were brave and noble Americans doing the right thing -- but one was the first and most influential president of the United States, whose decisions and actions set standards and shaped the world from that time onward. These are just a few of many issues where gonzo conservatives draw a line in the sand and fight for positive change. Gonzo conservatives are here to stay. Perhaps they have always been here and just feared to speak out. In the end, they are punk rockers who believe in the government staying as small as possible, keeping taxes low and acting when necessary to defend the country. They trust the people with their own money, and their own choices, within reason. They admire and respect the men who wrote the Constitution and Declaration of Independence -- documents that have served as the model for democracies the world over. And as punk rock fans, when they see intolerance in the world, or oppressive economic practices, or people afraid to speak out, they fight. They just don't let others pick the battles anymore.

21+ Replies

Haggard (April 9, 2004)

"Imagine if "affirmative action" extended to one's favorite band. The Beatles were four white men. Should they have had to hire "someone of color" to fill a quota? How about if the Bad Brains had to hire a white person on drums" Yeah, this guy is a fucking idiot. Everyone knows affirmative action is not really like that but right-wingers continue to speak half truths and bash it. "The upper echelons of public education have been so co-opted and warped by politicized teacher's unions" Oh my god. The reason our public schools suck is because Reagan gutted the funding for our schools and destroyed them. The same thing is happening with Bush. Here, I will give you an example. In the 60's and 70's California used to have the best public school system in the world. Everyone would try and copy their's. But when Reagan became Governor he gutted funding for the schools an

show rest of comment

dazed (April 9, 2004)

Exactly. Both of those presidents invested in a military to play with rather than the future of the country.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

yeah well some of the income taxes that take money away from the "working man" go towards him being able to get help if he gets layed off, gets hurt, retires etc. Also, maybe you overlooked this, but we have a PROGRESSIVE income tax in this country which is supposed to favor income taxpayers. So don't try to say you're vouching for ole' Joe Six-Pack

Someone (April 9, 2004)

low income taxpayers*

Someone (April 9, 2004)

oh yes, the republicans care sooo much about public education, ask any teacher!

Someone (April 9, 2004)

yeah, there's nothing wrong with bush and the republicans trying to shift the tax burden onto earned wealth rather than inherited wealth.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

Im done with with that dude...every time i hear a down by law song i think i will cringe.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

Unity and being the same are two different things. Get them straightened out.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

I don't that any of you actually read the article. Dave is a very intelligent and well spoken individual. Ohh but I forgot that Kerry is our new lord and savior, and that Fat Mike is his hight prophet. When are you people going to realize that Kerry and the Democrats are no better than Bush and the Republicans. You are selling yourself short when you let an overweight middle-aged punk rocker make up your mind for you.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

...if no one read that article, then these people just made some really good guesses as to what it was about. I applaud them.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

Say what you wish but I really don't think that him being over-weight or middle-aged has anything to do with anything...try giving reasons to back up your case instead of using the "he's old and fat excuse". That's preschool.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

I did it was the "punk rocker make up your mind for you" part. None of you think for yourselves. Like Dave said, You are all sheep.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

seig heil fuckface

Someone (April 9, 2004)

So you think everyone who things bush is the biggest fucking asshole and hitler type president is because of fat mike? So we all should jump on the smalley bandwagon and believes what he says? Then we wouldn't be all sheep right?

dazed (April 9, 2004)

I feel like Dave is being led too, by his new neoconservative heros. We're all led by some ideology or another. I don't consider myself a sheep for coming up with my own opinion that Bush is an imprudent president who doesn't mind using somewhat shady tactics to get what he wants. No, he's not the devil. Yeah, he is my president currently, but not the one I'm going to choose on my ballot in November.

Someone (April 11, 2004)

"imprudent president who doesn't mind using somewhat shady tactics to get what he wants" Just like every president for the last 70 years or so. One of the biggest offenders of this was your lord and saviour Bill Clinton.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

seem like the overwieght middle-aged punk rocker dave smalley made up your mind for you

Someone (April 9, 2004)

George Washington was the first American President, he was good and all, but sadly he isn't actually that important.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

Holy fuckin shit , thats he longest comment i've ever seen.not that i actually read it . that comment is GAY.and how gay is too gay? (fuck) that comment

Someone (April 9, 2004)

I'm all for conservative politics...but that doesnt mean Bush follows conservative politics. He's far from it. We're fucked either way. Slowly we're losing our rights and our country, who you vote for only determines what rights you lose first. FUCK BUSH. FUCK KERRY.

dazed (April 9, 2004)

I feel the same way, but I don't believe Kerry is actually going to be able to follow through with his party's plans for more economic socialism, whereas I think Bush has a good chance to further erode our protection under the Bill of Rights. So I'm voting Kerry in lieu of any valid electable and moderate Libertarian candidate/party.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

"These are just a few of many issues where gonzo conservatives draw a line in the sand and fight for positive change. Gonzo conservatives are here to stay. Perhaps they have always been here and just feared to speak out. In the end, they are punk rockers who believe in the government staying as small as possible, keeping taxes low and acting when necessary to defend the country. They trust the people with their own money, and their own choices, within reason. They admire and respect the men who wrote the Constitution and Declaration of Independence -- documents that have served as the model for democracies the world over." Can't we just act educated and say that some punks are Jeffersonian Republicans?

infopunks_network (April 9, 2004)

totally. and it's not like bush upholds "smaller government", anyway. the government has grown more under him than the clenis. and the price of gas has increased so much that it has eaten any bit of a middle class tax cut. now instead of giving that money to the evil government who pays our cops and firemen, we give it oil companies! awesome trade! the conservative punks all try to act like we're all sheep on the left because we disagree with them. but what is even more sheepish is claiming to be a conservative when you support a president who is nothing but a religious-right activist parading as a conservative. hating queers ain't conservative, buddy. living by and adhering to conservative values is. maybe you guys should try to draft pat buchanan.

dazed (April 9, 2004)

A few things: 1) Most public schools aren't all that bad. A lot of Republican created proposals and tests, especially in this state, cut funding from the schools which are that bad which are usually conveniently located in poorer minority areas where voter turnout is low. I don't see the "gonzo conservatives" on Jeb Bush's team giving half a shit about the disenfranchisement they are creating domestically. 2) There are more parties out there than Democrat and Republican, and they BOTH go almost equally overboard with spending. The "gonzo conservatives" still pork barrel spend to get re-elected, they just don't propose a way to pay for it (taxes). 3) I don't see these "gonzo conservatives" with all their "great" intentions and actions actually paying the troops in Iraq wartime compensation. I mean, Dave Smalley can believe what he wants, it's a free country, and he shouldn't

show rest of comment

Someone (April 11, 2004)

It's nice how any divergence from all the leftist assholes on this MB gets pounded from all sides. God forbid someone disagree with you, sheep. So let's be all hands across America for Saddam Hussein, who destroyed entire cities with chemical weapons. Pull your heads out of your asses, you bleeding heart fucks.

Someone (April 12, 2004)

Actually, that column pretty much confirms that Smalley is one of the most well-spoken guys out there. I think he writes really well. He definately makes some good points about punk rawk needing to be more accepting of diversity in our scene. Reasonable people disagreeing reasonably, and all that.

KirbyPuckett (April 9, 2004)

Something's wrong. This has been up for around half a day and there's still only 30 comments? That must be some kind of record for a Punkvoter article. C'mon kids, start bitching about Fat Mike some more. - Kirby

2+ Replies

Someone (April 9, 2004)

i bet that smalley thing above will help out the comment count.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

Fat Mike is fat no he isn't

Someone (April 9, 2004)

The Alk3 songs sounds like a watered down Strung Out song to me. I like it though. -duped

1+ Reply

Someone (April 10, 2004)

hey I tought the same. kinda weird

Someone (April 9, 2004)

Not My Political Advisor

4+ Replies

Someone (April 9, 2004)

Thats hilarious. -sickboi

Someone (April 9, 2004)

wow thats amazing.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

That would have been better if whomever made it wasn't completely devoid of photohopping skills. I like how the Fat Logo had to be added so you would even know who it was pictured.

Someone (April 10, 2004)

yeah, you must have great "photohopping " skills huh jackass

KB (April 9, 2004)

Dude, Fat Mike has openly stated that he plans on losing money on this whole venture. He's (supposedly) planning a free tour to support the cause

1+ Reply

Someone (April 10, 2004)

There is a free tour, pal. It's the Punk Voter tour with NOFX and Alkaline Trio. There's also a third band, but it's different for different parts of the country. I know Authority Zero is coming to most of the Southwest and that the Dillenger Four is on part too. It'll be at colleges around the country.

Yossarian (April 9, 2004)

I wanted to hear the Alk3 song, but it just wouldn't stop playing antiflag over and over...I don't even like antiflag.

1+ Reply

dazed (April 9, 2004)

Yeah I kept refreshing the page. It played tons of NOFX, Anti-Flag. After about 10 tries I got the Soviettes song, after about 20 the Alk3 one. I never did find out if there was a 5th song.

Someone (April 9, 2004)

In response to Dave Smalley's post above: "Let's be truly a colorblind society, and let all people's talents shine, regardless of the color of their skin." I agree, but those living in poverty do not have an equal opportunity for their talents to shine due to the economic circumstances in which they reside. Thus, affirmative action was created in an attempt to level the playing field. I think the way to solve the "race" problem in affirmative action is to make it class, rather than race based. Then minorities will still benefit from it, as well as whites. Did you know that there are actually more poor WHITE PEOPLE than black people in this country? (Due mainly to the fact that there are more whites in this country.) However, there is a higher percentage of blacks that are in poverty in comparison to whties. I don't know the numbers, but basically this means that if w

show rest of commentIn response to Dave Smalley's post above: "Let's be truly a colorblind society, and let all people's talents shine, regardless of the color of their skin." I agree, but those living in poverty do not have an equal opportunity for their talents to shine due to the economic circumstances in which they reside. Thus, affirmative action was created in an attempt to level the playing field. I think the way to solve the "race" problem in affirmative action is to make it class, rather than race based. Then minorities will still benefit from it, as well as whites. Did you know that there are actually more poor WHITE PEOPLE than black people in this country? (Due mainly to the fact that there are more whites in this country.) However, there is a higher percentage of blacks that are in poverty in comparison to whties. I don't know the numbers, but basically this means that if whites have 15% poverty rate, then blacks have a 20% poverty rate. "Why do the rich, mostly white politicians in the "education party" fight against school vouchers -- something that helps poor minority kids escape the chaos?" Regarding school vouchers and school choice programs, I myself have actually done some research on this topic, and I will cite the journal article that I studied: "Private Choices, Public Consequences: Magnet School Choice and Segregation by Race and Poverty" by Salvatore Saporito, from the journal "Social Problems" volume 50 pages 181-203. For those in school still, (and skeptical of what I say, or more interested) go to your library and look this up in the online journal search (Lexis-Nexis or whatever). Social Problems is a scholarly journal, meaning it's not some biased for-profit bull crap magazine, it's intention is to publish research done by the acedemic community. So in his article, Saporito found the the magnet school program in Philadelphia, which allows students to move from the school nearest them to a "magnet school" that has specialized curriculums was being used by WHITE PEOPLE to get away from minorities. Basically, the findings show that the amount of segregation in a school INCREASED after students left for magnet schools. The study also shows that the more affluent students (i.e, those whose parents make more money) were more likely to move to a "magnet school" thus, leaving higher percentage of poor students behind. Studies have also shown that students who are poor perform better when surround by more affluent students. The findings of this article can be used to support the notion that voucher programs would result in similar results: whites abusing the program to get away from minority groups and poorer students. Now THAT is why I am against voucher programs, they make it worse for the students left behind. What we need is a nation-wide standard that all schools must perform at, and rigoursly enforce it! We also need to distribut tax dollars more evenly, rather than on a localized basis. Send more money from the suburbs to the inner cities! Make it equal! That's the problem with the conservative ideals, they assume that everyone has the same level of opportunity, but depending on where you are born, it will be harder for you to succeed. Can anyone think of a politician, or anyone successful (besides a hip-hop artist)for that matter, that grew up in Compton? If we want to have a truly "fair society" that David Smalley refers to, then we need to give the poor people a better chance than we are now, because right now they are getting screwed. I was once a conservative, but then I took a Sociology class and saw all the inequality in this "land of opportunity" in which we live. I don't consider myself a "sheep", I came to my current viewpoints through academic endeavours, and studying in depth the problems our society faces. I suggest that everyone else who reads this do the same, and then form an opinion on what we as a country should do.

3+ Replies

Someone (April 9, 2004)

i dont care aboot long comments , so stop writing them.

slippy (April 10, 2004)

for the record, I'm not a sheep being directed by the punk community. It pains me to even hear that. No, I'm not a conservative either. Just because I'm not a republican doesnt make me a conformist. Dave Smalley is trying to fuck with your mind.

Someone (April 12, 2004)

I didn't read it that way at all. Dude, he's just saying that everyone shouldn't have to think the same way. In fact, I read it as saying those on the left shouldn't demand that everyone agrees with them. In other words, he's supporting people having different opinions. Ain't nothing wrong with that!

Someone (April 12, 2004)

I thought Dave Smalley made some damned good points, actually. His main point seems to be is to think for yourself and don't demand that everybody else think like you or me. It didn't really seem to be an attack on anyone, as much as a pretty fair exploration of some viewpoints. He wasn't calling you a sheep, but instead telling all of us to not be sheep for anybody. And I actually agree with that.

TheOneTrueBill (April 9, 2004)

http://www.morbidcheckers.tk Free EP up for download!

2+ Replies

Someone (April 9, 2004)

asshat

Someone (April 10, 2004)

I dont careeeeeeeeeeeeee ohoh

Someone (April 13, 2004)

Response To Punkvoter.com Not too long ago, I was made aware of a list that appeared on the website punkvoter.com called 15 Reasons Why You Should Hate The President. The website recently posted its “three clear objectives”: ((1) To activate punks and other disenfranchised young people to participate in elections. (2) To vote Bush and the Republicans out of office, and (3) to build a coalition of informed voters who can individually and collectively influence public policy. These objectives clearly show you the agenda of Punkvoter.com, but they show more than that. Punkvoter.com’s motives are not the pursuit of truth, but their collective contempt towards George W. Bush and all Republicans. Objectives 1 and 3 are contingent on objective 2. This explains the “15 Reasons Why You Should Hate The President” - a flawed attempt to influence the reader to despise President Bush and Republicans.

show rest of commentResponse To Punkvoter.com Not too long ago, I was made aware of a list that appeared on the website punkvoter.com called 15 Reasons Why You Should Hate The President. The website recently posted its “three clear objectives”: ((1) To activate punks and other disenfranchised young people to participate in elections. (2) To vote Bush and the Republicans out of office, and (3) to build a coalition of informed voters who can individually and collectively influence public policy. These objectives clearly show you the agenda of Punkvoter.com, but they show more than that. Punkvoter.com’s motives are not the pursuit of truth, but their collective contempt towards George W. Bush and all Republicans. Objectives 1 and 3 are contingent on objective 2. This explains the “15 Reasons Why You Should Hate The President” - a flawed attempt to influence the reader to despise President Bush and Republicans. Punkvoter.com would like you believe it is trying to create a coalition of “informed voters” - when in fact it is not. In an attempt to right a severe wrong done by Punkvoter.com, I have taken the site’s list called “15 Reasons Why You Should Hate The President”, done real research (which the author of the list clearly did not do) and have proved just how misleading, inaccurate, and sometimes blatantly false the author’s statements regarding President George W. Bush and his administration are. The youth of American cannot be subjected to such leftist political diatribe anymore. They need to be shown that they are never getting the full story, or the truth from websites such as Punkvoter.com. People who author lists like “15 Reasons Why You Should Hate The President” only care about that 2nd Objective - and that to them is more important than the truth. They will twist and spin facts and make allegations to promote their beliefs and indoctrinate the impressionable minds of young people who they know will not take the time to research these statements like I did to find they have been duped. Below you will find each item on Punkvoter.com’s despicable list (in bold)followed by my response debunking it (in blockquotes). Send this to your friends, and young people, and show them how Punkvoter.com and other sites like it have been lying to them. 1) He cut a half a BILLION dollars from the Environmental Protection Agency’s budget. Who needs to look after the environment when there’s all that oil drilling going on? President George W. Bush’s federal budget proposal for the fiscal year 2002 to the U.S. Congress gave $7.3 billion to the Environmental Protection Agency operations and programs… which is $56 million MORE than President Bill Clinton requested in his 2001 budget.(1) Regarding the drilling, there would be nothing but benefits if we drilled for our oil. 1.5 million acres of the total 17.5 million total (which is only 8%) is being considered for development and less than 2000 acres of that 1.5 million will be affected if oil is discovered.(2) The existence of oil pipelines in other regions of Alaska has actually helped the caribou population grow considerably.(3) 2) He approved a bill that denies financial aid to students convicted of misdemeanor drug charges (though convicted murderers are still eligible for financial aid). This is incorrect. This is referring to an amendment of the 1998 Higher Education Act that denied financial aid to students convicted of misdemeanor drug charges.(4) Bill Clinton was president in 1998. 3) He recently sent a delegation to the UN children’s summit to declare that the use of condoms is not a valid way to fight AIDS and that abstinence is the only solution. This is the view shared by some other countries such as Iran, Iraq, Sudan, Libya, Syria, and the Vatican. It seems that his policy of, “No child shall be left behind” has a whole new meaning. According to the White House, the goal of Federal policy should be to emphasize abstinence as the only certain way to avoid both unintended pregnancies and STDs(5) - which it undoubtedly is. The countries mentioned above are all countries with a state religion - religions that actually prohibit the use of contraceptives. This example only attempts to suggest the Bush’s policy is similar to that of countries who actually enforce religion on it citizens, and use violence as a means of enforcement. Bush’s policy merely stresses the fact that abstinence is the only 100% sure way to prevent STDs and pregnancy ? the policy of the other countries is that the use of contraceptive devices is prohibited - these are drastically different policies. 4) He wouldn’t sign the Kyoto Protocol agreement on global warming, which was ultimately signed by 178 other countries. He also told the entire European community that he would listen to their arguments, but he would not change his mind, effectively treating Europe like an 8 year old child. This may have something to do with why most of the world hates the US. First, only 84 out of a total of 123 countries signed the treaty. And as of February 24, 2003, less than 60 have actually ratified it.(6) Can anyone trust the legitimacy of this entire list when the author invents 55 countries? Next: Not participating in the Kyoto Treaty was not a new policy of the Bush administration, but rather a continued policy of the Clinton Administration - which sat on the Treaty for 3+ years after the conference. Since taking office, President Bush has stated his reasons for not accepting the treaty, which includes the exemption of China and India (two major population centers) from compliance with the treaty. Also, the Senate voted 95-0 against ratifying the treaty.(7) It’s rather unfair to blame President Bush when the Senate could have approved ratification without him. Amongst other things, CONSAD Research Corporation have concluded that if the USA ratified and implemented Kyoto: it would drive up prices on all consumer goods, 3.1 million would lose their jobs The U.S. standard of living will decrease as working families are forced to reduce consumption of goods and services in every major category-including food, energy, and health care.(8) Not only would the Kyoto Treaty cripple the United States economy if we ratified it, according to many experts, would not have any positive effects on the environment.(9) 5) He rejected an international accord to enforce the 1972 treaty banning germ warfare. Of course that would mean that the US would have to stop producing biological agents too. In a unanimous review by the Bush Administration’s interagency team regarding this treaty, they concluded that the current version of the protocol would be inefficient in stopping cheating, and that all its deficiencies could not be remedied by the negotiating deadline.(10) 6) And talk about the fox watching over the hen house, he nominated former mining company executive Dan Lauriski as Assistant Secretary of Labor for Mine Safety and Health. Would you rather have Bush nominate someone with no experience in that field? Would you hire a doctor to defend you in court, or hire a lawyer to do open heart surgery on you? 7) He allocated only 3% of the amount requested by Justice Department lawyers in the governments continued litigation against tobacco companies. The particular lawsuit in question here suit sought billions of dollars to cover the cost of treating sick smokers through federal health insurance programs. Which basically means that smokers think that Phillip Morris Co. and other tobacco companies should be paying for their health costs because they chose to smoke. This is grossly unjust. People have been well aware of the health risks involved in smoking tobacco products for many, many years and this is merely an attempt of extorting money from these companies. 8) He prohibited any financial aid from going to international family planning organizations that provide abortion counseling, referrals, or services with their own funds. For the sake of consistency, how can the pro-abortion movement tell the government that their body “is their business” but then demand government money pay for their abortions? If abortion is not a government issue, then government money (a.k.a. taxpayer dollars) should not go towards funding them. 9) He provided every member of the Bin Laden family living in the U.S. a chartered plane shortly after 9/11 to fly back home to Saudi Arabia without questioning them. One of GW’s first petroleum ventures was partnered with the Bin Laden family and George Sr. has been getting filthy rich selling defense contracts to the Bin Ladens. These are just some examples of the many ties the Bush family has with the Bin Ladens. This is referring to Bush’s connections with The Carlyle Group, a buyout firm, one of the nation’s largest defense contractors, based in Washington, D.C., which does have investors from Saudi Arabia, including Shafig bin Laden, one of Osama’s many brothers.(11) Besides the fact that the bin Laden family has “disowned” Osama, they have also severed ties with The Carlyle Group, and the company has also given the bin Laden family back about two million dollars which they had invested.(12) These connections are exaggerated and do not connect the Bush family or anyone else to terrorism. 10) He officially withdrew from the 1972 Antiballistic Missile Treaty, gutting the landmark agreement-the first time in the nuclear era that the US renounced a major arms control accord. Two countries signed this treaty 30 years ago. Only one of those countries still exists today. Upon the collapse of the Soviet Union, this treaty was in effect null and void. Further, the treaty prevented the United States from developing technology to PROTECT ITSELF from a missile attack. One of the jobs of the President of the United States is to be our Commander-In-Chief, which means he has an obligation to protect the citizens of America. With several countries wanting to attack us, or gaining the ability to attack us with air to ground missiles and/or nuclear weapons, (Iraq, N. Korea, & China, for example) would it not be irresponsible for a President to ensure our country is prepared for a possible missile attack on our country? 11) Refused to join 123 nations pledged to ban the use and production of anti-personnel bombs and mines, February 2001. President Bill Clinton was the one who refused to sign the 1997 Treaty banning APMs.(13) 12) September 2001: withdrew from International Conference on Racism, bringing together 163 countries in Durban, South Africa. The White House and the State Department specifically objected to two proposals of the conference, put forth by African and Arab nations, which politicized the conference. The first being “reparations for slavery” from America and other Western nations; the other condemned Zionism as “racist."(14) 13) Over the past 10 years, the US prison population has more than doubled. This is mainly due to unfair three strikes laws, and harsher drug penalties. OK so maybe W. wasn’t behind this one, but the Republicans are. The “Three Strikes Law” was a provision under the 1994 Crime Bill Act, which was passed by congress (including a Democrat controlled Senate)(15) and signed by President Clinton.(16) Regardless of whether you agree or disagree with this provision, it’s quite difficult to blame this one on the Republicans isn’t it? Also, In the year 2000, drug related crimes accounted for only 11% of all arrests.(17) The allegation that harsher drug laws had any significant affect on the US prison populations is completely absurd. In fact, drug related arrests went down from 1999-2000. An estimated 1,042,334 drug related arrests were made in 2000, while in 1999 there were 1,557,100. (18) 14) International Plan for Cleaner Energy: G-8 group of industrial nations (US, Canada, Japan, Russia, Germany, France, Italy, UK), July 2001: the US was the only one to oppose it. This summit is not much different then the Kyoto protocol. The Bush Administration is not opposed to anyone using “cleaner energy” for anyone may choose to consume cleaner energy - but the Bush Administration feels it is irresponsible to impose it regardless of the cost to consumers. President Bush has also advocated the development of new technologies to address the issue cleaner energy.(19) Aside from that, the methods of ?cleaner energy? include wind, water and solar energy. To generate energy from these sources requires the building of dams, covering undisturbed hillsides with windmills and solar panels - which aren’t “clean” solutions by definition of many environmentalists. 15) George replied, “Ken who?” when asked about his relationship with Kenneth Lay, the CEO of Enron, during the federal bankruptcy hearings. This was after Enron gave him their company jet to use for his presidential campaign. George and Kenny were such good friends that Ken was actually seen giving wedgies to the president in the oval office. Yet he still replied, “Ken who?” The point of this appears to be to link President Bush with Kenneth Lay? somehow suggesting there is a damaging connection between the two. Clearly the fact is ignored that the Bush Administration chose not to bail out Enron during its troubles. Also, if a relationship between Bush and Lay is up for criticism, does the author of this list condemn Bill Clinton for taking a $100,000 donation from Enron in 1993?(20) What about the high level executives of Enron who were also were invited to the Clinton White House? The scandal-ridden Enron had closer to ties to the Clinton Administration and the DNC than to the Bush Administration. Aside from the many improprieties of the Enron-Clinton connection, Enron gave its largest single donation ever (which was over $100,000) to the Democrats in 1995.(21) Sources: 1. http://www.epa.gov/ocfo/budget/budget.htm 2. http://www.anwr.org/topten.htm 3. http://www.anwr.org/topten.htm 4. http://www.ed.gov/legislation/HEA/sec483.html 5. http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2002/02/welfare-book-06.h tml 6. http://unfccc.int/resource/kpstats.pdf 7. http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2001/03/20010314.htm 8. http://www.ceednet.org/resources/pdf/981271.pdf 9. http://www.herald.ns.ca/stories/2002/11/14/f162.raw.html 10. http://fpeng.peopledaily.com.cn/200105/21/eng20010521_70549.html 11. http://www.fortune.com/fortune/articles/0,15114,370593-2,00.html 12. http://www.fortune.com/fortune/articles/0,15114,370593-2,00.html 13. http://www.cnn.com/WORLD/9712/02/land.mine.conference/ 14. http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/briefings/20010727.html 15. http://www.senate.gov/artandhistory/history/common/briefing/Major ity_Minority_Leaders.htm 16. http://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/1996/candidates/democrat/clinton/i ssues.shtml#Crime 17. http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/cius_00/00crime4.pdf (Table 29) 18. http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/Cius_99/99crime/99c4_01.pdf (p. 217) 19. http://www.aip.org/enews/fyi/2001/029.html 20. http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2002/2/28/12723.shtml 2 1. http://www.newsmax.com/showinside.shtml?a=2002/8/19/104416 Matt Margolis posted his wisdom at 12:00 pm Part of the category: The Right Idea ©2003-2004 MattMargolis.com

1+ Reply

Someone (April 15, 2004)

http://www.humans.com/pages/damncommies.shtml

Someone (April 17, 2004)

This is fucking cool man. Even this shit would go in the charters for bush's fuckbuddies.

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