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Epitaph Records -- Millencolin

Against Me!

Searching For A Former Clarity
2005
Fat Wreck Chords

Against Me! - Searching For A Former Clarity (Cover Artwork)


Review by: Aubin
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Fat Wreck Chords (Logo)

Published on September 6th 2005

I remember the first time I met Against Me!, I was scheduled for an interview, and this was shortly after the release of ...Eternal Cowboy. The band was playing at a tiny little venue in Toronto, just a staircase away from a dimly lit pub. Even though I knew the band was fairly young, having listened to ...Axl Rose and particularly The Acoustic EP, I had an image formed in my head of a quartet of grizzled punk lifers, looking each day like they had spent the previous sleeping on a street corner.

The band itself didn't really match my mental image, and I was temporarily taken aback by the young band, who seemed to possess a musical maturity that belied their ages. I was scheduled for what the local Fat rep, Melanie Kaye, called a “round table” interview, which meant that I was supposed to trade off questions with other writers. Personally, I'm not terribly fond of these types of interviews, finding that my relatively quiet demeanor makes it difficult to interject frequently with questions. Only two of us had arrived at that point, the other looking like a slightly cleaner Keith Morris, and myself. The other interviewer was pretty aggressive but also pretty gracious, and gave me ample opportunity to ask some questions, very few of which were particularly insightful. Still, the interview went well enough and I had enough material for a story.

It wasn't until a week later that I learned that the sound check had drowned out the little material I had, making the interview completely inaudible. However, losing that interview was no great loss, particularly when compared to what I didn't even think to record: After our chat was over, I had a few moments to waste. My girlfriend was currently at the hospital, tending to a sick father who had just undergone an angioplasty, and I was to arrive there in about an hour. So I suggested to the band that I buy them a drink as we waited for our mutual obligations.

True to form, the band each bought the closest thing to a Guinness, a thick Irish stout that had the consistency of a milkshake; I bought a light beer, imagining that my drunk appearance at the hospital would probably be less than cordial. It wasn't until we sat down with our pints that I actually saw the real band; Tom, Warren and I sat and talked; we discussed the legacy of Johnny Cash who had passed away a few weeks earlier; we talked about the Clash, women, punk rock, anarchists and the vehement anger of the “anarchist” punks who slashed their tires, vandalized their van and generally attacked them at each venue of their tour. This wasn't a ploy for sympathy or something they hoped I would publish but the honest revelations of a bunch of guys sitting around drinking.

That image popped into my head last week as I stood in what Toby called a “bear bar” in San Francisco, a bar where he received a call from Tom describing their recent experience playing in front of thousands of people on their date with Green Day. I didn't hear the conversation, but apparently Tom felt that it went well but was nevertheless a daunting experience. This is doubtless, considering the band probably performed in front of more people that night then they drew on that entire first tour.

But the seemingly sudden rise of Against Me! is nothing if not deserved. Each album has seen the band reinvent itself, with the songwriting becoming more varied and more mature. A larger palette seemed to accompany each release, and new revelations with each word. The Acoustic EP was sparse, minimalistic and startlingly clear; Axl Rose brought about a bigger sound, but you could still hear the ringing of the guitar strings between each note. With Cowboy, the band brought even more to the table, with a louder, more dominating band.

With this release, the evolution of the band has certainly continued. Each track is startlingly dense and J.Robbins has given the band an almost impenetrable wall of sound. Unlike the simple shout-along melodies that adorned previous albums, ...Clarity demands repeated listens far more than any previous album. That's not to say the band has abandoned their crowd-energizing anthems though; tracks like “From Her Lips To God's Ears” with its chant of “Condoleeza!” will certainly have their share of audience participation.

When I first heard a few tracks from the album, my immediate reaction was to compare the band to the Replacements, and I think the comparison still stands; like Westerberg's seminal band, the band seems to incorporate punk rock, country and folk, but with Clarity it seems the band has finally managed to fuse these elements seamlessly in a single track. Songs like “Violence” and “Unprotected Sex With Multiple Partners” do this almost effortlessly (though I must confess that the latter disappoints a little with a somewhat annoying chorus, despite a great opening and confessional lyrics.)

With the exception of that track's chorus, however, the album is uniformly solid. Lyrically, the band is treading into more personal territory, with “Pretty Girls” and “How Low” addressing similar relationship territory to Cowboy's “Sink, Florida Sink.” Internal turmoil and self-loathing are also well represented, with songs like “How Low” and the title track showing Tom at his most painfully confessional.

The political feelings of the band are represented, but the band takes a far more individualistic tone, focusing lyrics on the effects of politics on real people. A track like “Justin” eschews complex political diatribes, instead discussing the Iraq war as it pertains to the recruiting, death and media coverage of a single soldier. As well, the events that were documented in last year's DVD are also addressed with many allusions to the dirty politics of the music business, a situation into which the band has been thrust far too violently.

Against Me! has quickly gone from a great band with a small but devoted fanbase to a large one, almost despite the band's efforts to grow gradually. Listening to the record, I still find it hard to believe that this album was written by some guy I sat around drinking with; it's ambitious, fully realized and truly special. It's also a conflicted record; it's filled with internal ruminations, raw emotions and a distancing wall of sound, but it is nevertheless their most thoughtful and accomplished piece of songwriting and a record that grows more rewarding with each listen.



People who liked this also liked:
Against Me! - As The Eternal CowboyAgainst Me! - is Reinventing Axl RoseThe Lawrence Arms - Oh! Calcutta!The Clash - London CallingNOFX - The DeclineOperation Ivy - Operation IvyThe Lawrence Arms - The Greatest Story Ever ToldAlkaline Trio - GoddamnitThe Lawrence Arms - Apathy and ExhaustionAlkaline Trio - Maybe I'll Catch Fire



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    Posted by TommyPickles on 2008-03-20 18:22:07

    Say what you want but I think this is Against Me's best album.

    Posted by xshoutoutx on 2007-10-05 22:17:08
    My Score:

    "searching for a former clarity" is a song i hold dear to me, eventhough this cd is mediocre for AM!, it's still very well composed! I love them!

    Posted by Squidy on 2007-04-27 09:44:49
    My Score:

    truely amazing album.

    Posted by mike_litt69 on 2007-02-09 18:09:58
    My Score:

    i really liked this album. it wasnt as good as their older stuff but it was still damn good. definetly better than "eternal cowboy". this album seemed a lot more politically charged than their last release. it also seemed to have more songs that were genuine and written from the heart. "from her lips to god" is a well writen political song and "problems" and "searching for a former clarity" seemed to capture the raw emotional side of tom gabel.

    Posted by EverybodyLies on 2007-02-04 09:41:29

    Damn. I wish I could get hold of the "stolen demos". So far I've had no luck. *cries* D:

    One of my favourite bands since a friend introduced me into them a while back. Awesome lyrics and catchy feel!

    My favourite of their albums would have to be Reinventing Axl Rose.

    Posted by assgoblin on 2007-01-07 15:35:42
    My Score:

    I don't know about you guys, but Against Me! definetly dropped off after they signed to Fat. Don't get me wrong it is still good music, but it is no where near as influential as their early recordings.

    Posted by assgoblin on 2007-01-07 15:35:25
    My Score:

    I don't know about you guys, but Against Me! definetly dropped off after they signed to Fat. Don't get me wrong it is still good music, but it is no where near as influential as their early recordings.

    Posted by BANGARANG on 2006-11-25 04:04:46

    great review.

    Posted by Stefano on 2006-09-06 20:40:32
    My Score:

    i never liked against me! never got into them,didn't think they sucked but never thought anything they played,wrote or sang about was exciting in the least. i've heard them,seen them,yeah.nada,nothing.

    i had the chance to go on the warped tour for a few weeks this past summer with an amazing bunch of people. saw against me! and what really hit me was "CONDOLEEEZZZZZZZZZZZAAAAAAAAA" god damn that shit was good. i ended up having some spare loot and picked up what was recommended as the better record "searching for a former clarity". on the way back to new york in a sweaty,hot van i tried to listen to the record and thought it was good at best. picked up the new another breath which desrtoyed anything in my cd player for a month onend till i randomlly popped in the against me! record and had it playing for over two months non stop till all my cd's got stolen from work.

    this record is a masterpiece.fuck yes,it is.

    Posted by ABedForLiars on 2006-09-02 16:35:58
    My Score:

    Wow, this album is briliant. They created a masterpiece without selling out. Unlike some idiots, I'm sticking by them and their Sire release next year.

    I love this album. FUCKING MIAMI!!!

    Posted by larold on 2006-07-14 15:14:16

    oh boo hoo they signed to a major...good for them! cry if they change their sound on the next record on the major....thats the only time people should bitch about things like that.

    Posted by kill_fftl on 2006-05-10 22:40:14

    to bad they sold out

    Posted by PacePicante on 2006-03-25 02:34:50

    I definately think that this is their worst CD
    It has like 3 good songs
    some mediocre songs
    and some really shitty songs like Justin and How Low

    Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, March 19, 2006 at 10:51 PM (EST)

    damn i jus herd the demo of this....its so much better the production on the album makes his voice so irritating

    Posted by GlassPipeMurder on 2006-03-16 13:21:25
    My Score:

    "This record is the "London Calling" of this generation."

    Why are people on this site such idiots?

    Posted by nikko on 2006-02-04 16:55:51
    My Score:

    has anyone even read the lyrics to "Even At Our Worst We're Still Better Than Most (The Roller)" seems to be about a lot of people in here.As for them signing to a new label they were already being called sell outs for being on fat wreck chords which is ridiculous.this may not be the greatest album ever but its really not that bad.

    Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, January 8, 2006 at 10:52 PM (EST)

    Hey,

    Admittedly, I was kind of pissed off when I first heard As The Eternal Cowboy. It's very different, and one could argue, selling out.

    But honestly, at least they're changing. I don't want an anarchist AC/DC that never changes.

    Also, they're charging more for tickets, CDs, whatever. A lot of people bitch about this. Honestly, have you ever tried to be a working artist, musician, actor, band, whatever? If you have a serious problem with them for this, then you probably haven't.

    Word up, starving fucking sucks. Driving those "million miles" to a show sucks. Living in a shithole sucks. Living in a bad neighborhoods sucks and is scary.

    It's not easy being an artist in America when the general society mocks and belittles everything you're trying to do. It's even harder when the people you're trying to reach out to give you shit when they don't even begin to understand.

    So yeah, I'm defending the band. Anyone who has actually tried to do more than just be a scenester should.

    Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, December 29, 2005 at 2:05 AM (EST)

    Also-don't be pissed at them for changing.
    Tom wrote alot of those songs (like Reinventing Axl Rose) at a very young age.
    Anyone who plays music knows that your style changes as you write,especially over the span of 4 or 5 years.
    It's expected.
    It's not the old acoustic stuff,but it still dosen't suck.
    If they didn't change you'd be pissed that this record was more of the same.

    Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, December 29, 2005 at 2:02 AM (EST)
    My Score:

    I really enjoyed this album, especially after hearing that "stolen" demo that included a bunch of tracks from it.
    I was shocked to hear that they signed to Sire,but listening to this record again,the lyrics pretty much shout it out to us.
    The songs show him growing farther and farther from how things used to be,and signing to Sire is the culmination of all this distance.
    Does anyone else see this?

    Posted by justinius23 on 2005-12-13 07:38:48
    My Score:

    first of all, i'd like to say that this is the first against me! album i ever listened to. before i had only heard 'pints of guinness make you strong' and 'cliche guevara' on compilation cd's.

    i don't know anything about the members of against me!, their politics or what they they were like or did before they got 'signed'.

    i have listened to 'searching...' for two months straight now and all i can say is that it is a fantastic album. i honestly cannot find a fault with it.

    and yes, i have ordered all their earlier stuff, i just hope it is as good as this record

    Posted by warningdevice on 2005-12-07 09:30:41
    My Score:

    This record is the "London Calling" of this generation. These guys truely are something original in a music scene that is packed with shitty bands that think they're original... when they're really just a carbon copy of every band they look up to. I strongly reccomend you buy this record... NOW!

    Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, December 6, 2005 at 6:19 PM (EST)

    "against me! used to be gloriously amazing back in the day. now they come out with songs like ‘Even At Our Worst We're Still Better Than Most (The Roller)’ first of all, that’s one of the stupidest song names I’ve ever heard. well ok maybe it’s just pretty far up the list. anyway, listen to these pathetic whiny annoying hopeless pussy lyrics that make you want to punch a fucking baby

    You can have it all, I ain't got the heart to fight, no.
    Total exhaustion, complete breakdown. For the asshole I am,
    apologies in full, please leave me alone.
    Pull over the van, let me out...."

    -----------------------------

    Man, someone got some sand stuck up in their asshole.

    Posted by Anonymous on Friday, November 4, 2005 at 6:19 PM (EST)

    Do yourself a favor and don't buy this cd. Save your money for This Bike Is A Pipe Bomb and Defiance, Ohio cds.

    Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, October 25, 2005 at 3:51 PM (EDT)
    My Score:

    extremely dissapointed, but i still absolutly love this band and what they did for the punk scene. The only song that reminds me of the Against Me! that i know is Problems

    Posted by Anonymous on Monday, October 24, 2005 at 1:46 AM (EDT)
    My Score:

    Dear Haters...

    Please shut up. Try to actually listen to this record. It's good. We only wish that other bands out there displayed this level of sincerity.

    Yours truly,

    EVERYONE ELSE

    Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, October 23, 2005 at 2:50 PM (EDT)

    against me! used to be gloriously amazing back in the day. now they come out with songs like ‘Even At Our Worst We're Still Better Than Most (The Roller)’ first of all, that’s one of the stupidest song names I’ve ever heard. well ok maybe it’s just pretty far up the list. anyway, listen to these pathetic whiny annoying hopeless pussy lyrics that make you want to punch a fucking baby

    You can have it all, I ain't got the heart to fight, no.
    Total exhaustion, complete breakdown. For the asshole I am,
    apologies in full, please leave me alone.
    Pull over the van, let me out.

    And we'll give the money back, to the record label.
    Fire the agent, fire the manager.
    We ain't got what it takes, to make it.
    We got indifference, got no respect for them.
    Feels like you already said so much,
    feels like you can never say enough.
    Let someone else take our place,
    let them be your entertainment.

    I MEAN SERIUOSLY PEOPLE! THIS IS NOT THE AGAINST ME I KNOW! WHAT THE FUCK HAPPENED TO SONGS LIKE

    "Reinventing Axl Rose"

    We want a band that plays loud and hard every night
    That doesn't care how many people are counted at the door
    That would travel one million miles and ask for nothing more than a plate of food and a place to rest
    They'd strike chords that cut like a knife
    It would mean so much more than t-shirts or a ticket stub
    They'd stop at nothing short of a massacre
    Everyone would leave with the memory that there was no place else in the world
    And this was where they always belonged
    We would dance like no one was watching
    With one fist in the air

    FUCK!!!!

    I am officially giving up hope on this band. they are dead to me.

    Posted by prankish on 2005-10-18 22:34:17
    My Score:

    Against Me! doesn't have to "surpass" their previous albums in order to make a great fucking record. If nothing else, SFAFC should get you excited to hear some of their old tracks remastered.

    The album lags a bit in the middle, but some of the tracks are the best they've ever produced. Miami, for one, is fucking unbelievable.

    Posted by marky6045 on 2005-10-14 23:36:35

    This album is very good, but not on par with RAR or the Acoustic Ep. I suggest you buy those two and Vivada Vis, and skip As the Eternal Cowboy.

    Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, October 4, 2005 at 11:06 PM (EDT)

    okay, here's the truth. you can save yourself a lot of time and money on the Against Me! catalog by buying only "Reinventing Axl Rose" and the Acoustic EP, both on vinyl. They will never surpass these two records.

    Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, October 1, 2005 at 10:04 PM (EDT)
    My Score:

    Not a perfect score because of the horns in Miami... sheeeesh.

    Posted by Anonymous on Monday, September 26, 2005 at 1:55 AM (EDT)
    My Score:

    Wow! I think this is at least as good as As the Eternal Cowboy. nice to finally listen to something other than the Sufjan stevens and New Pornographers albums-that is actually good in 2005!

    -bemused-

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 21, 2005 at 1:48 AM (EDT)

    Keep on working your 9 to 5s and trashing bands that are doing what they love and probably what you'd love to be doing yourself that is if you had the love or the talent, you leeches.

    Posted by dogshit on 2005-09-15 04:17:28

    all of the shit that gets said on the internet.... it's cool. you have to believe in it for it to upset you. BUT..... i fucking double dog dare you to actually talk this kind of shit face to face with the people in the band. it's easy to do in the comfort of your home on the computer with no one around, but how do you think it would go down actually looking someone in the eye and telling them how much they suck? do you think you could do it? tell them why you personally hate a group of people that play music. please tell them! be brave.... you can do it! get off of your computer and actually learn to interact. try it. the results would be way more interesting than a bunch of tangents posted on a messageboard that consists of people with way to much time on their hands. (me included)

    Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, September 15, 2005 at 4:11 AM (EDT)

    i fucking double dog dare you to actually say some of the shit you are saying (safely typing on your computer) to any of the members of this band. see how brave you are when you actually have to look into someones eyes and discuss something. i guarantee you that you won't be so brave. please do it and see what happens. please. argue with them about how they are sellouts, and see how they respond. have ACTUAL human contact, cause my friends.....this shit is not actual human contact.

    Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, September 15, 2005 at 4:06 AM (EDT)

    i fucking double dog dare you to actually say some of the shit you are saying (safely typing on your computer) to any of the members of this band. see how brave you are when you actually have to look into someones eyes and discuss something. i guarantee you that you won't be so brave. please do it and see what happens. please. argue with them about how they are sellouts, and see how they respond. have ACTUAL human contact, cause my friends.....this shit is not actual human contact.

    Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, September 15, 2005 at 4:01 AM (EDT)

    i fucking double dog dare you to actually say some of the shit you are saying (safely typing on your computer) to any of the members of this band. see how brave you are when you actually have to look into someones eyes and discuss something. i guarantee you that you won't be so brave. please do it and see what happens. please. argue with them about how they are sellouts, and see how they respond. have ACTUAL human contact, cause my friends.....this shit is not actual human contact.

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 14, 2005 at 11:21 PM (EDT)

    you guys have no idea what shitbags these guys are. they are awful human beings, just awful.

    Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, September 11, 2005 at 9:11 PM (EDT)

    I love this album and I love their old stuff, but on different levels. It's two completely different sounds and they shouldn't really be compared.

    I just can't wait until November to see this on the Fat Tour. It will be fucking amazing.

    Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, September 11, 2005 at 11:27 AM (EDT)

    I thought music was about unity, but perhaps I was wrong. Who cares if you grew up in a barn, or if you were born into money, or if you like to go to dance clubs. No one cares.

    There are four people in AM! They make music to make themselves happy and people happen to enjoy it. They don't owe any of you anything.

    It is easy to see where their motivation for "Don't Lose Touch" came from.

    Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, September 10, 2005 at 9:44 PM (EDT)
    My Score:

    The more I listen to the album the more I am coming to the conclusion that it is really something special. I would have never thought I would have used the word "beautiful" to describe an Against Me! album.

    Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, September 10, 2005 at 4:49 PM (EDT)

    Condaleeza is more mature and intelligent than any song Anti-Flag ever wrote.

    Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, September 10, 2005 at 1:26 PM (EDT)
    My Score:

    You people are ridiculous! This is an amazing album, it might not be "Reinventing Axl Rose" but it's much better than "As the Eternal Cowboy" (which was also awesome). Instead of worrying about Against Me "selling out" (Because Fat Wreck Chords might as well be Sony, Shell, Walmart, and McDonalds all wrapped up into one, right?) spend your time worrying about something that actually matters.

    Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, September 10, 2005 at 7:15 AM (EDT)
    My Score:

    Pretty decent album.
    HOWEVER, Against ME! should stay away from politics.
    -or at least stay away from writing unbelievably simple-minded, seemingly mandatory Bush bashing songs. (A Fat Wreck contract requirement?)
    I cringe (and sometimes laugh) every time I listen to Track 5 when they are hollering "Condoleeza".
    I'm a big fan of Against Me! and I listen to many political bands but, damn, I thought they were more mature than this.
    Dillinger Four is an example of a band that handles politics in an intelligent way.
    My advice to Against Me! is to stick to the personal lyrics and stay away from the high school politics. It really doesn't suit them.

    Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, September 10, 2005 at 2:54 AM (EDT)

    FUCK THIS BAND. FUCK THIS REVIEW. FUCK THIS SITE.
    -love pitchfork

    Posted by Anonymous on Friday, September 9, 2005 at 10:58 PM (EDT)

    this band fucking blows!

    Posted by Anonymous on Friday, September 9, 2005 at 7:01 PM (EDT)

    "This is the internet. It's not possible to walk on the internet. However, you can talk on the internet. This is why you're only seeing talk, and no walk. When modern science allows us to walk on the internet, and whoever-the-fuck you're quoting doesn't walk, then what you're saying won't be stupid as hell."

    My favorite quote too - and it's even making fun of me!

    Posted by the_wang on 2005-09-09 09:07:03

    all the haters have aids. aids, aids, aids.

    Posted by Anonymous on Friday, September 9, 2005 at 5:18 AM (EDT)

    will is punx. well just till he gets outta High school. Then he'll toss all his minor threat shirts.

    You have a band will? I bet all the "anrachy" folk will not dig it

    Posted by Anonymous on Friday, September 9, 2005 at 4:45 AM (EDT)
    My Score:

    "it's like their primary influence was the kill bill soundtrack"

    if someone can tell me what that means, i would appreciate it. I'm being genuine here.

    Cause right now i feel like I walked mid-stream into a conversation that has already been going on and all I have to go on is "....but maybe frogs are supposed to bend like that"
    and its a book club, and they are reviewing the color purple, and my brain now has to make that make sense, but if you CAN connect those dots you might find the answer or you might make a dot matrix of god's name backwards which makes your nose start to bleed and your mind wrap itself around things you can't process, and its like that movie 'the gate' with the whole backwards song gates of hell thing.

    Incidentally, While I still find eternal cowboy a car wreck of a record, an identity crisis for against me no longer just the tom show, but still not sure of how to work as a larger band in a studio, I have to admit, this record which will never be given a chance with the taste eternal left in mouths, is actually really solid. Compare the short # of short hurried songs on eternal with this batch of long, developed, full songs, now confident as a full band. I do like it.

    wyzo

    Posted by Anonymous on Friday, September 9, 2005 at 2:50 AM (EDT)
    My Score:

    Score is for Little Britain. Also I just wanted to add one more post on here cause i sorta feel bad for AM! cause it doesnt seem they get enought attention on this board....no one seems to post comments when it comes too them.

    Posted by fattony on 2005-09-09 00:30:11
    My Score:

    Great album, though not as consistent as their previous releases. This will still probably make it into my top 10, but the competition this year isn't that stiff.

    Posted by aubin on 2005-09-09 00:27:57

    This is the internet. It's not possible to walk on the internet. However, you can talk on the internet. This is why you're only seeing talk, and no walk. When modern science allows us to walk on the internet, and whoever-the-fuck you're quoting doesn't walk, then what you're saying won't be stupid as hell.

    My favourite comment under this review, hands down.

    Posted by wehavecomeforyourchildren on 2005-09-08 21:24:08

    oh yea, and dillinger four are the best band ever. i mean it. seriously. they are the BEST band ever.

    Posted by wehavecomeforyourchildren on 2005-09-08 21:22:08
    My Score:

    i really wanted to like this cd. i REALLY wanted to like it. i only liked two songs on eternal cowboy but i was hoping they'd win me back. i started listening to against me years ago when it was just tom and some guy on drums (not warren) and i saw them when they were on tour.

    but this album just sounds fake to me. it's like their primary influence was the kill bill soundtrack. why is tom doing that goofy shit with his voice half the time? what is with "miami! fucking miami!" who thinks that shit is good?

    i still didn't write it off after the first four songs turned me way off, i trudged on. and luckily i discovered that some of the songs towards the end are better. tracks 9, 11, 12, and 14 are all alright. and maybe they'll grow on me more. but most of this just seems gimmicky.

    Posted by fistchode on 2005-09-08 21:13:46

    This is the internet. It's not possible to walk on the internet. However, you can talk on the internet. This is why you're only seeing talk, and no walk. When modern science allows us to walk on the internet, and whoever-the-fuck you're quoting doesn't walk, then what you're saying won't be stupid as hell.

    Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, September 8, 2005 at 8:18 PM (EDT)

    "I don't plan on staying young forever, but I will try to uphold my personal ideas of what's right and what's not. If I find something not feasible or unrealistic, I'll probably try to fix it, but so far I've known lots of people who have reached 25 without abandoning their ideals."

    Lots of talk, not much walk.

    Posted by SenorRefresco on 2005-09-08 18:54:03

    "Justin" sounds kind of similair to "Jesus Doesn't Want Me For a Sunbeam" by the Vaselines. Am I the only one that thinks this.

    Posted by AlmostPunkEnough on 2005-09-08 16:58:37

    holy shit jones, what did you do down there??

    what the fuck is going on haha?

    Posted by stevejonestherealbones on 2005-09-08 16:31:32

    what the fuck was that shit all about down there.

    anyway, yeah Will. if you ever get it online, i'ld like to hear it

    - joneeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeees

    Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, September 8, 2005 at 4:18 PM (EDT)
    My Score:

    Hahaha, now you can't sass me anymore.

    -Will

    Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, September 8, 2005 at 4:15 PM (EDT)
    My Score:

    "Hey, thanks for showing me that post from Chris PIX....

    I still think they need to get off their DIY high-horse, lead by example, not by calling people out."

    Who are they calling out? Show me one example of this? What DIY high-horse? They don't do any namecalling to anyone- they simply say what they feel is right and live by that.

    Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, September 8, 2005 at 3:53 PM (EDT)

    Steve, none of it's online right now. If you want me to email you when it is, I'd be glad to. I released a "trisect split" in a limited quantity of 50 copies once... It's very weird stuff, and you might dig it if you appreciate extreme minimalism and weirdnesscore. Oddly enough, no one who sets up shows has a copy, and I don't care, because they're mostly assholes.

    SickBoi, I would melt down the rocketcar and communally distribute it among the people!

    -Will

    Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, September 8, 2005 at 3:53 PM (EDT)

    Steve, none of it's online right now. If you want me to email you when it is, I'd be glad to. I released a "trisect split" in a limited quantity of 50 copies once... It's very weird stuff, and you might dig it if you appreciate extreme minimalism and weirdnesscore. Oddly enough, no one who sets up shows has a copy, and I don't care, because they're mostly assholes.

    SickBoi, I would melt down the rocketcar and communally distribute it among the people!

    -Will

    Posted by stevejonestherealbones on 2005-09-08 15:43:34

    will,

    are you in a band/make music? is any of it online?

    - jones the bones

    - stevejones8770@yahoo.com

    Posted by sickboi on 2005-09-08 15:36:52

    Come on Will, you'd sell out...

    Why? Three words:

    Soild Gold Rocketcar

    Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, September 8, 2005 at 3:21 PM (EDT)

    I'm not upper-middle class at all. My parents didn't buy me a car, I have to save up for college, and I wasn't born with a trustfund. I live in a house that got renovated from a barn forty years ago. While I don't have to worry about getting shot by gangs or drug dealers, I don't have a lot of the comforts many of my suburban peers do. I'm not trying to garner pitty, either, I'm just clearing up the popular misconception on this web site that I hole up on the computer using mommy's bank card to order records all day. I'm on the computer as much as I am because I'm in advanced writing courses.

    I don't plan on staying young forever, but I will try to uphold my personal ideas of what's right and what's not. If I find something not feasible or unrealistic, I'll probably try to fix it, but so far I've known lots of people who have reached 25 without abandoning their ideals.

    I can't say what I'd do if I got the chance to hit it rich and make money off my music. I don't think I'd be able to do that without changing my style. So I'd definitely understand if people lost respect for me.

    -Will

    Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, September 8, 2005 at 3:04 PM (EDT)

    I pre-ordered this from No Idea and dont have it yet...

    Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, September 8, 2005 at 1:23 PM (EDT)
    My Score:

    The more I listen to this, the more I like it

    Posted by AlmostPunkEnough on 2005-09-08 05:03:36

    i read BSD's comments and i wanna respond, then i read Dante's and he already said what i was going to. i hate you Dante.

    i'll say that i used to believe in a lot of what you say, Will. but when i got older i realized that a lot of it is only good in theory. it's not fun when they cut your electircity every few months, when they turn off your heat or when you get kicked out of your apartment. i don't know your financial situation, but i assume you're at least upper-middle class. hopefully you'll always stay that way. if you don't, you'll 'get it' real quick, you gotta do what you gotta do so you don't get your ass booted on the street.

    i'm not looking to ever be rich, though that would be nice. i do, however, work too much just so i can barely be comfortable. if i ever got the chance to 'sell out' somehow, i don't know if i could turn it down. i have no aspirations of being famous, i don't think i would like it, so we'll leave that out. but staying true to what you believe is hard, and life gets in the way more than you would think.

    i'm not gonan say you're immature, in fact, i think you're remarkably well-spoken. more than any other 17 year old here, and moreso than me. you bring up a lot of valid points, but you also make some points only a 17 year old could truly believe. you seem to think things through well, and as you get older and life kicks you in the balls, i think you'll respond well. but your ideals will change with time, even four or five years. and if you honestly think that isn't true, then i can't take you as seriously as you would like to be taken.

    as stupid as it sounds, trying to be a decent human being is harder than staying true to any jackass 'punk' ethos.

    Posted by SomeoneAnonymous on 2005-09-08 04:59:34

    I just bought this cd and I've only listened to it once, but I like it a lot already. You peeps are CUH-RAZY!!!

    Posted by REALPUNX4LIFE on 2005-09-08 03:14:50

    "'Music is one of the few art forms that now costs thousands of dollars to create.'

    bach begs to differ."

    No way, those Skid Row records were way overproduced. You're an idiot if you think Bach didn't mind spending money to make money.

    PS That guy said music is NOW one of the few art forms. Johann Sebastian Bach don't got shit on NOW, dumdum. It's like you're disagreeing with that guy by agreeing with him. Awesome!

    PPS Sebastian Bach don't got shit on now, either.

    Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, September 8, 2005 at 1:24 AM (EDT)

    Paying for Music is like Paying for Sex. Eff That!

    Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, September 8, 2005 at 1:23 AM (EDT)
    My Score:

    BUY MUSIC. Who Does That?

    Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, September 8, 2005 at 12:52 AM (EDT)

    Honestly. Fuck Green Day, Fuck H20, Fuck Franz Ferdinand, Fuck The New Lows and Fuck Spiderman 2 .

    Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, September 8, 2005 at 12:49 AM (EDT)

    The music video for "Don't Lose Touch" literally had a shoe-string budget. I mean come on guys. We know you are gonna cash in on us having nothing better to listen to. Make me want to buy your music!

    Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, September 8, 2005 at 12:46 AM (EDT)

    "Unprotected Casual Sex With Multiple Partners" rocks. Its Against Me!'s "Take Me Out" or "Cold Shivers" which ever overrated band you want to compare them to today.

    Posted by Russe11 on 2005-09-08 00:27:47

    Honestly people don't question a bands integrity unless there latest release is (in the listeneners opinion) a shitty album. Thats where H20 failed, and dillinger 4 succeeded.

    Posted by Russe11 on 2005-09-08 00:25:20

    Because every dillinger four album pwns.

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 11:29 PM (EDT)

    Do yourself a favor and order 3 albums by This Bike Is A Pipe Bomb and spend it on those instead of getting this album. Not that SFAFC is the worst ablum I've heard in a long time but is definitely not up to par with their other albums. I really like this band and I have been let down with this cd.

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 11:21 PM (EDT)

    The 3 tracks on "The Disco Before the Breakdown" is better than all 14 tracks put together.

    Posted by stevejonestherealbones on 2005-09-07 23:04:29

    i'm holding in my shit right now, that way it will feel really good when i have to leave it in the toilet

    - jones the bones

    - stevejones8770@yahoo.com

    Posted by elliot on 2005-09-07 22:54:20
    My Score:

    this album is the bomb. seriously. that last song gave me chills. all these songs are strong in their own way.

    has anyone even considered the possibility that the disco/franz ferdinand parts in "unprotected sex" could have been purposely ironic, since that song is an attack on the current state of the music business? not too hard, people....

    to everyone talking shit: i dare you to start a band, make some amazing albums, and then take a huge chance with your music, yet still maintain your sound. you won't be able to. but against me did.

    Posted by swingline on 2005-09-07 22:52:37

    sad to say but this is kind of gay.

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 10:25 PM (EDT)

    Because Dillinger Four fought God and won! They can do whatever they want.

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 10:15 PM (EDT)

    "Music is one of the few art forms that now costs thousands of dollars to create."

    bach begs to differ.

    Posted by geoffweobb on 2005-09-07 21:33:00

    Blah, Blah, fucking Blah- Good album!

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 9:01 PM (EDT)

    I'm quite sure Dillnger Four have played arenas with Green Day as well. Why does no one question their integrity?

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 9:00 PM (EDT)

    "Against Me! didn't sell out."

    Oh right, they bought in, my mistake.

    Posted by stevejonestherealbones on 2005-09-07 20:46:19

    i wish you guys would both hit "enter" more often when you went on rants.

    - jones the bones

    - stecvejones8770@yahoo.com

    Posted by Dante3000 on 2005-09-07 20:43:36

    This appears to be going somewhere in circles. Here is what you seem to be forgeting. Music is one of the few art forms that now costs thousands of dollars to create. I beleive art and money shouldn't be joined unconditionally but at the same time how do you suppose a band get any message put out there?
    It costs money to get instruments. Money to get a practice space or at least somewhere to practice. Money to produce, press, ship, and indeed shelve and album. And it takes a shit load of money to tour. No band has ever broken up because they aren't making enough money with music, they do it because their jobs don't make enough money to support the most expensive hobby ever.
    As for AM! laying down their integrity. I spoke with Tom after EC came out and asked if he felt any conflict about it. He said the guys at No Idea were his friends and it was a great experience to be able to put out records with your friends. He said when they agreed (not signed, I don't believe they ever actually had a contract) to put out a record with Fat (oh in addition Toby offered the band a Seven inch Tom pushed the whole album) he wanted to make sure it was a company he supported. Tom knows that Fat is a different deal that No Idea but at the same time they do some amazing work. He knows that when AM! records are sold now that money helps keep the 20 staff members of Fat employed and he knows they're treated fairly at their job. He knows Fat doesn't use sweatshop labor even though it's cheaper. He knows that by releasing an album on Fat they can have their music produced better and heard by more people without feeling that the profits from their record sales were supporting questionable companies. And mostly (and I quote) he knows he, "Can call them at three in the morning, Flordia time, and talk to them drunk".
    I know last time I talked to them they all worked different jobs and still used a van (maybe a camper) to tour. There was no bus driver and no limo. Perhaps there will be a shared bus on the Fat Tour I don't know.
    I do feel a lot of great bands have made a living and great music without sacrificing one or the other but I fail to see how AM! has done so. Perhaps they don't embrace anarchy as fully as they once seemed to. Perhaps they sell more records than they once did. Shit, maybe they even played a stadium show with Green Day. But at the end of the day these are four guys who have worked harder than damn near anyone in music today. And I fail to see how any of what they have done has changed their message. I'll admitt it's more focused. Where "Y'all Don't Wanna Step to Dis" was much broader and focused on general political issues much of SFAFC is much more about instances and particulars. And I'm ending this here...This is too long and it's too random to continue.
    -Dante

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 7:57 PM (EDT)

    to the guy who posted this

    J"ust out of curiosity, what are these great bands that you like? Are they contemporary or just like The Clash or the entire SST catalog? I mean, there are conflicting opinions about AM!'s recent releases, but I really haven't heard many people label their old stuff merely "ok". In my endless quest for great music, any help from a kind old sage would be extremely helpful"

    well I actually am very much into almost the entire SST catalog i.e. Bad Brains, certain Black Flag albums (not the ones you'd think), Husker Du, Minutemen/Mike Watt etc. also I'm very into Big Black, Shellac and Steve Albini's stuff in general, FEAR is a big favorite of mine, X is as well, Gorrilla Biscuits, Minor Threat, Fugazi, Butthole Surfers, Meat Puppets etc. By the way, I loved London Calling but alot of the rest of the Clash's records get on my nerves. As far as contemporary bands, there aren't many due to the fact that punk rock has long become a joke that mocks what it once stood for for so many kids. I did like some of the early Hot Water Music records but they got pretty tired sounding around No Division. I admit that I liked Mute Print alot by A Wilhelm Scream but I kind of despise their new record, way overuse of harmonies and the songwriting is not on par with their older stuff. I like Sleater Kinney alot as well. Like I said, Against Me! were an ok band...not too hot not too cold. There's plenty of older music out there that I haven't heard yet so I consider my money better spend on better bands. I don't just listen to "punk" or what you'd at least like to think is punk so I get to see alot of shows, smaller ones only...that are still good.

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 7:44 PM (EDT)

    I totally agree with Will on this one

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 7:28 PM (EDT)

    Yeah, but you're assuming I find stuff questionable... Plenty of my friends have lost places. Hell, when a band breaks up telling people they weren't making enough money, I tell them that they were in it for the wrong reasons. Making a living is important, and while I don't feel that people have to (I feel fortunate for being able to categorize and number auto parts), I think it's a healthier way to live. I just don't think that business and art have any place mixing- especially with something that supposed to be destroying that way of thinking.

    That's where the big difference will be. If you think of punk as something with the potential to create/destroy on a large scale, you will kind of lose respect for the business tactics of many music companies. If you just like to hear some "catchy tunes", then you won't mind the stuff being sold in chains and advertised on TV or radio.

    My personal opinion runs somewhere in middle. I like the Hives, and they definitely aren't a grass roots anti-corporate rock band. Then again, they never told me I was a spineless liberal or sang about creating a global underground. Even though I don't usually think a band being sold in chains is that bad, when the band pretends to represent some ideals (and Against Me! used to, you can make an argument against that with their new stuff, but "Crimes" and "Reinventing" definitely played to the anarchist crowd around here and many other places), it's dissapointing when they just lay down and kill their integrity. Does this say anything about Fat, really? No, I think that's a really extremist way of thinking, since Fat itself doesn't push for a mainstream audience. I think the ambition is all on part of Tom and the rest of the band.

    Say what you will about "making a living", but I don't think that should have anything to do with making music. Plenty of underground bands have stuck to their guns and carved out memorable, lasting marks in music.

    -Will

    Posted by McGarnicle on 2005-09-07 19:21:01

    ""We'll bordinate the marketing?"

    Any point you were trying to make was lost by use of the word "bordinate." Against Me! may be sellouts, but they dont make up words.

    --------------------

    Yeah, everyone knows only the Steve Miller Band gets away with making up words.

    Posted by SenorRefresco on 2005-09-07 18:51:56

    Against Me! didn't sell out.

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 6:35 PM (EDT)

    ""We'll bordinate the marketing?"

    Any point you were trying to make was lost by use of the word "bordinate." Against Me! may be sellouts, but they dont make up words.

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 5:56 PM (EDT)

    Dante for the win.

    Posted by Dante3000 on 2005-09-07 17:48:23

    Will, I don't discount your comments on music (though we rarely see eye to eye on such matters). I'm talking about your comments regarding most business politics and DIY ethics. It’s easy to make such comments when you’ve never run a business or had to worry about where your next meal comes from. It’s simple to think that the commoditization of punk music by a record label is a cardinal sin if you’ve never had to worry about making ends meet.
    I’m glad you work, I can respect anyone who does anything to pay any part of their own way. However, working when you’re 17 is a whole different ball game than working at 23. I’ve had a job ever since I was 14 and I thought I was the shit at 14 making $6.75 at Safeway bagging people’s groceries. And while it is nice to have your own money to buy your own stuff (instead of kids who do nothing to earn money) it’s not earning a living. When you’ve known a friend who has faced or been evicted you understand why some people will do some things you used to consider questionable for money (not meaning drug dealing). I hope you keep your attitude Will, because in 10 years I can actually see you forming it with some real world experience to makes some pretty solid (and functional) moral and political beliefs. However, at 17 everything you say sounds slightly convoluted.
    -Dante

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 5:26 PM (EDT)

    Your mom is a 7.
    I agree that it's a 9, not quite the 10 this site handed out to it.
    -------------

    WHAT? That was just lame ma'am

    The debut album is not that great. Gets kindof boring at times.

    Baby, I'm an Anarchist! and 8 Full Hours of Sleep are terrible

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 5:14 PM (EDT)

    "And I think most of the "real punks" I knew folded the minute thier first rent check was due. Now I'm not saying anyone here will do that. However, it is my reason for taking a 17 year olds political stance too seriously.
    -Dante"

    1) I work inventories at auto shops. I don't have to pay my rent, but I pay for some of my food and most certainly any music I've bought for the last year and a half.

    2) I'm sure when you were my age, you didn't expect what you said- about music of all fucking things- to count, because of your situation. If you did, you're most certainly an asshole, because I know a lot of 25 year olds who, while I'm not "buddy-buddy" with, don't dismiss my opinions because I'm a teenager. That's what parents and teachers are for.

    -Will

    Posted by McGarnicle on 2005-09-07 17:12:25

    the lyrics in this are horrible...touring with Jimmy Eat World and Green Day? No Thanks! I know what happens to bands like these:

    - they started out as a good band, pretty regular, not bad but not too good either

    - they got the No Idea records Gainesville thing going with them

    - They put out that dumb Axl Rose album and got some attention from slickly produced boring Fat Rex

    - All of a sudden these guys are all over the place and they're cutting medicocre records

    - flavor of the months syndrome kicks in, the fans who thought the band was special loose intrest with the hype and the stadium tours with Green Day etc.

    - newer younger fans tkae hold of something that seems edgy and "punk rock" then get bored soon

    - you don't hear anything from them for a while, the cut a few albums that go unnotice and then make their stupid comeback

    see H20, Pennywise etc. for examples

    I won't buy in

    -------------------------------

    Just out of curiosity, what are these great bands that you like? Are they contemporary or just like The Clash or the entire SST catalog? I mean, there are conflicting opinions about AM!'s recent releases, but I really haven't heard many people label their old stuff merely "ok". In my endless quest for great music, any help from a kind old sage would be extremely helpful.

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 4:55 PM (EDT)

    I wonder if the new propagandhi will top this album?

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 4:26 PM (EDT)

    "AXL was a 7"

    Your mom is a 7.
    I agree that it's a 9, not quite the 10 this site handed out to it.

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 4:21 PM (EDT)
    My Score:

    The lyrics are better than ever before. My favorite part of Against Me! was the singalong choruses, and unfortunately this CD has very few. This makes it harder to get into any individual song right away, but this album definitely gets better with every listen. The last two full-lengths from this band were simple and easy and stuck to you the first time. You have to digest these to really appreciate them.

    Posted by REALPUNX4LIFE on 2005-09-07 16:18:38

    Well I'd say the first half of your quote is very tongue-in-cheek. All those PIX board babies were crying about that song right after they rushed to download it the second it leaked. I think that part is fucking hilarious. "We totally sold out the scene!" They're playing on the way that people perceive them now. The second half is either their reasoning for these moves or just a comment on the way that the "scene" operates these days.

    Should I replace "scene" with "business"?

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 4:14 PM (EDT)
    My Score:

    i think against me is trying to tell us something. with lyrics like ""Mediocrity Gets You Pears (The Shaker)"

    There's a target on the audience
    We're only in it for the money.
    We took the movement to the market.
    We totally sold out."

    "We'll bordinate the marketing,
    label publicity touring.
    Consult the representation, go ahead put this in context.
    It's 3 points on production, 15% to management,
    10% to the agent, 5% to legal representation.
    We gotta a insurance, never make it as far as you can.
    Gotta make your money while you got the chance,
    do whatever it takes to sell it."

    perhaps they realize that they have to comprimise to make a decent living. or something, i don' t know... but there are all kinds of clues relating to this througout the album

    Posted by psychoos231 on 2005-09-07 15:58:34

    AXL was a 7

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 3:27 PM (EDT)
    My Score:

    This cd disappoints me... about as much as Cowboy disappointed me after Axl Rose. So that's not saying too much, because Axl was the definition of a 9/10. This is still a decent album, but I was expecting more. Maybe that was unfair, but I don't apologize for setting high standards for bands who've raised them before.

    - Optimistic Punk, age 25

    Posted by poopypants on 2005-09-07 14:54:51

    all of you have dick 4's on your heads

    paul

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 2:28 PM (EDT)
    My Score:

    Score is for your comment Jonesy. Pat yourself on the back

    Posted by MrStabone on 2005-09-07 13:13:21

    "- flavor of the months syndrome kicks in, the fans who thought the band was special loose intrest with the hype and the stadium tours with Green Day etc."

    it amazes me how playing one show with Green Day equals touring stadiums

    you people are seriously fucking nuts to care so much about stuff that doesn't even effect you

    i give no fucks

    Posted by wehavecomeforyourchildren on 2005-09-07 12:20:35

    as far as the whole plan-it x thing is concerned, who gives a fuck if they've got records in the stores when you can order them postage paid for something like three dollars online?

    there is absolutely no reason to badmouth plan-it x. "if it ain't cheap, it ain't punk!" i wish more labels thought like that.

    ....although i will admit that when bands charge more for cds and make more off cds, they have more time to make music, which benefits fans. more bands break up over money related stress than people realize. touring is expensive and in a world where everyone else has great sounding recordings, lots of bands get caught up in paying for that too.

    plan-it x is still chill.

    Posted by wehavecomeforyourchildren on 2005-09-07 12:11:34

    "Disco only had 3 songs right? Ony the title track was good the other two were shit off that."

    shut the fuck up, you brain dead motherfucker.

    sorry if track one was the only song that could hold your attention, but the other two were just as good. "begining in an ending" was better. did you even give the other songs a chance? did you read the lyrics? fuck off.

    Posted by Dante3000 on 2005-09-07 12:05:49

    Sickboi I'm only 23...Sorry grandpa. But if it makes you feel any better I apparently look like I'm fucking dying. My first day of work someone asked if I was 26 and another asked if I was 30 something, christ my looks are going town the toilet faster than an unwanted pregnancy on prom night.
    Oh, by the way, where do you work? I'm at a museum right now, education is Punx rawk!
    -Dante
    P.S. I'm soo sorry for some many things in that post.

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 12:03 PM (EDT)

    this album is good. none of you have got the balls to be punk anyway so stop talkin shit!

    Posted by poopypants on 2005-09-07 11:55:05

    i like that its long...one of my biggest gripes w/ 'eternal cowboy' was how short it was

    also, the lyrics to 'dont lose touch' are not bad at all, its a pretty accurate statement to the way we live today; see also: punknews.org threads about diy ethics....perhas we ARE taking ourselves a little to seriously?

    paul

    Posted by Scruffy on 2005-09-07 11:21:16

    I like that it's long. I miss the time when most punk albums that came out had at least 14 songs on them. I love spending ten bucks and getting so much music I almost need two sittings to listen to it all.

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 11:11 AM (EDT)

    "but why is it so goddamn long?"

    too make up for lost time. and the dazed stare we were all in after cowboy

    Posted by stevejonestherealbones on 2005-09-07 11:04:31

    see H20, Pennywise etc. for examples

    pennywise?

    what the eff? i thought i was not supposed to like pennywise because they never change their sound/style/lyrics, not because they sold out and ditched what they were doing or got too popular... i mean, ifuck, its so hard to keep track of what bands i'm supposed to hate and for what reasons around here.

    i mean for christsakes, i was expecting to bash MCR in that video thread, but i read the comments and i found out i had to figure out a way to say the video is good, but the music sucks!!

    its so hard to keep my likes and dislikes straight around here!!

    - jones the bones

    - stevejones8770@yahoo.com

    Posted by stevejonestherealbones on 2005-09-07 11:00:25

    "What I'm really concerned about is the lack of growling on this record.

    -Scott"

    you silly bitch.

    - jones the bones

    - stevejones8770@yahoo.com

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 10:47 AM (EDT)

    I don't think the lyrics are that bad but that song is awful. Pretty much every other song is great, however, and after about three or four listens this becomes better than any of their other cds.

    Posted by justatango on 2005-09-07 10:42:21
    My Score:

    good record..
    but why is it so goddamn long?

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 10:42 AM (EDT)
    My Score:

    the lyrics in this are horrible...touring with Jimmy Eat World and Green Day? No Thanks! I know what happens to bands like these:

    - they started out as a good band, pretty regular, not bad but not too good either

    - they got the No Idea records Gainesville thing going with them

    - They put out that dumb Axl Rose album and got some attention from slickly produced boring Fat Rex

    - All of a sudden these guys are all over the place and they're cutting medicocre records

    - flavor of the months syndrome kicks in, the fans who thought the band was special loose intrest with the hype and the stadium tours with Green Day etc.

    - newer younger fans tkae hold of something that seems edgy and "punk rock" then get bored soon

    - you don't hear anything from them for a while, the cut a few albums that go unnotice and then make their stupid comeback

    see H20, Pennywise etc. for examples

    I won't buy in

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 10:25 AM (EDT)

    The lyrics to "Dont Lose Touch" are so bad that it makes me cringe... anyone else agree?

    Posted by maverick on 2005-09-07 09:56:37

    What I'm really concerned about is the lack of growling on this record.

    -Scott

    Posted by Scruffy on 2005-09-07 09:45:26

    Also:

    "My gripe is that it's seriously easy to pitch around high morales and politics if you've never paid you're own bills. That isn't to say you suddenly become a capitalist republican the minute you have rent "

    Here, here. I became waaaay more liberal when I started to have to pay my own rent. That could be because it coincided with moving out of my parents' house to a liberal college, or it could be because I started to care about what happened to my money and the world I was now actually living in.

    Also, I can't believe I'm participating in such an obvious threadjack, so...this is a good album.

    Posted by sickboi on 2005-09-07 09:45:22

    I think the whole disagreement comes with people thinking music shouldn't be a business. But without it being a business, tours are harder, good record distro is harder, and more bands break up.

    Posted by Scruffy on 2005-09-07 09:42:13

    I know kids like this that manage to keep their DIY ideals when they're on their own. BUT...
    They do it by living on other people's couches and not helping with the bills.
    Or living off of their loans.
    I hate it when I work 40 hours a week and, before I graduated sent all my overage back so I'd have less debt, and some people get to do so much more than me because of their loans. Oh well, I'll have my loans paid off a good ten years before they do.
    I am NOT slamming DIY ideals, I just don't think the whole "I disagree with working a job" ideal is the only way to maintain your ethics.

    Posted by sickboi on 2005-09-07 09:19:24

    So, Dante, we're both 25 and work non-profit. Weird.

    Posted by poopypants on 2005-09-07 09:18:05

    oh yea, and speaking as a 25 year old, it is about 10000000times easier to be 'punk rock' when you're in highschool or college.

    paul

    Posted by poopypants on 2005-09-07 09:16:44

    oh and i think that guy meant that 'this place is run by a handful of bunch children'. i think

    paul

    Posted by Dante3000 on 2005-09-07 09:16:25

    I'm not badmouthing DIY ethhics or practices. I thought (and still do) that PIX is a pretty impressive label for doing what they do. I think they sound a little to high on the DIY horse sometimes but I don't know if I could ever recall them shitting on some other label/band.
    My gripe is that it's seriously easy to pitch around high morales and politics if you've never paid you're own bills. That isn't to say you suddenly become a capitalist republican the minute you have rent (I work for a fucking non-profit). However, I don't think I can recall one person who didn't pitch around their politics on DIY, and things in general, a little easier in High School than in college. And I think most of the "real punks" I knew folded the minute thier first rent check was due. Now I'm not saying anyone here will do that. However, it is my reason for taking a 17 year olds political stance too seriously.
    -Dante

    Posted by poopypants on 2005-09-07 09:13:57
    My Score:

    you guys have a whole lot to say don't you?...well...at least a whole lot to type.

    i feel bad for those of you who don't like this. i got it yesterday and it exceeds all my expectations. i think it kicks the shit out of 'eternal cowboy' which i thought was a solid album, but not as mindblowing as the hype made it seem. granted 'turn those clapping hands..' and 'cliche guevera' were 2 of my favorite songs of 2003...

    on this album they went more in the vein of 'turn those clapping hands' ...aka...epic sounding AM! songs, which is a great thing. the album is much more solid and has a better flow. the middle part of 'eternal cowboy' to me was totally forgettable. this is strong the whole way through.

    joy, problems, miami, violence, justin, don't lose touch...just after one listen and not having the track listing in front of me and those songs still really stick out in my memory. not one bad song.

    definately one of the years best, and i would not be surprised to see this end up in a lot of top 5 lists for the year.

    have yet to see them live...

    paul

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 9:05 AM (EDT)

    i bet justin is about JUSTIN SANE selling out!!!

    Posted by sickboi on 2005-09-07 08:49:02

    Just picked this up last night...
    Reminds me a lot of "Axl"....

    Some points:

    1. "Justin", "Problems", and "Energizer" are REALLY good live.
    2. "Energizer" and "Don't Loose Touch" are my 2 favorite songs.
    3. Bathing is in, stinkiness is out. We'll see what 2006 holds.
    4. DIY is cool, cheap shots at other DIY labels for not adhering to your own "ethics" is lame.
    5. 'Eternal Cowboy' was a lot more commerical-friendly than this.
    6. AM! has mastered "giddy-up-core" on this album.

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 8:48 AM (EDT)

    i'll be honest i respect will's musical opinion most of the time but his opinion on other things is a different story .......he talks sooo much shit about middleclass people and alll that stuff...but i have a theory that he is actually very well off...i may be wrong but this is what i figure..... we all know he is like 16 or 17.... so this means he doesnt really have a good job or old enough to have his own credit card.... which means he must borrow his parents cc to buy all those rare records and cds he has....and we all know he has a shitload....so as much shit as he talks he lives off of his parents money.....if i am wrong will correct me

    Posted by AlmostPunkEnough on 2005-09-07 04:57:42

    please don't respond to BSD's stupidity, it only feeds his ego. and yes, i know this post is only feedibng him more.

    plan-it-x has a bunch of great bands.

    "a bunch children"?? how do you miss 3 complete keystrokes?

    Posted by anarchaeologist on 2005-09-07 04:15:39

    This place is run by a bunch children.

    Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 7, 2005 at 4:12 AM (EDT)

    I think the boys in AM! are cute.

    Posted by fistchode on 2005-09-07 03:13:58

    It seems that people here think its impossible to live DIY, or think DIY when not living in your parents basement.

    It's not true, it's just harder. I'm not saying I'm a shining example for it (I'll soon be teaching upper middle class Japanese kids english), but just because you don't want to try, or think it's stupid to try doesn't give you the right to dismiss people who're trying. to do this shit. Like, for fuck's sake, if someone's calling you on your shit, why not just explain your point of view? And marginalizing someone's opinion as "young, stupid and smelly" is not doing that.

    Also, commodifying punk bands is putting the focus on the album as opposed to the band. It's doing publicity for the album to make it sell more. It's a focus on selling the product in any way possible (like Epitaph's links with Best Buy, or selling a toned down, kid friendly punk image) as opposed to making music available. I think lots of independent labels do this. I don't think Fat is one of the worst offenders though.

    Posted by bobbett on 2005-09-07 03:11:36
    My Score:

    i like this record. a lot. i'm a big fan of their earlier lp's, the eps and demo stuff, but i still like this record. the songs themselves are solid. some of them do seem to drag on a little too long on the first few listens, but the more i listen to it, the more i pick up on things i didn't hear the first few times. the sequencing on this is pretty damn flawless, too.

    i actually like will, i think his points are usually spot on. that's not to say that sickboi's or anyone else's aren't, but will does make good points that shouldn't simply be dismissed because of his age, employment status, etc. i agree with him that it would be best to do things on a diy basis, but i can't see any justification for besmirching a band just because they want to join a strong indie label such as fat or jade tree. i've found good bands through both word of mouth as well as the devilish internet.

    p.s. did anybody that pre-ordered the vinyl on no idea had this show up in the mail yet?

    Posted by thepuglife on 2005-09-07 02:47:40

    the melody's are nowhere near as creative as everything else they've ever done.

    its not a bad cd, but i'm dissapointed because in the past they've written some of the best songs i've ever heard.

    Posted by