seriouslyyyyyy

agnostic front is old, and so is sick of it all....douchebag

and jimmy gestapo still puts on a good show

I remember the days of being 20 years old, alas, I miss em' . The scene was so much different back then-oldpunker-

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

yeah really. seeing this makes me feel really old since i remember watching it when it aired. how about jello on oprah or gg allin and el duce on geraldo?

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Citizen_Crack (February 1, 2007)

jello on Oprah? where the fuck can I see that?

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

jello was on Donahue too

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Someone (February 2, 2007)

and GG was on springer, unless he appeared on geraldo too

either A) in their labratory moments away from finding a cure for cancer or B) working minimum wage at a pressing factory and leaking fall out boy cd's.

steve martin, the guitarist from AF at that time (not the one on the show) is now the biggest publicist in the music industry, he runs a company called Nasty Little Man who's clients include Foo Fighters, Beastie Boys, Beck, Radiohead, AFI, Alkaline Trio, Andrew WK and more.

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

zing!

STIGMA!!!1

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Rastid (February 1, 2007)

stiggmmaaa!!!!

young danny lilker right after he left anthrax to start nuclear assault

I thought so!!!

YES! Manon was her name. Considering that was five years later, I'm kind of surprised to see her looking so much the same. I had always had the feeling after seeing Another State of Mind that those kids in Canada were no more.

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

Yeah, I was surprised she was still alive. She actually looked much better in this show.

That girl seems like one of the biggest bitches in that movie

I bet they can't even do a spinning jumpkick right! Amatuers

You could use a good beat-down,ya fuckin taint sniffer..

Yeah,speak english or die !

agreed. HC gererally sucks. case in point: terror

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Big_Guy (February 1, 2007)

madball, hatebreed, and other bands that sound like them

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

Oh yeah, every hardcore band is tough chugga metal. You totally have this scene pegged!

-Will

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

You mean the scene that's you alone in your bedroom?

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

Terror aren't hardcore, more like Thug metalcore.

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

Ahh right, you see. I don't really like close minded people, but this is exactly what I like about music. Everyone has different likes and dislikes. I like NYHC and have liked it for years. It is old, I am getting old. You hang onto the things that remind you of your youth and no one can take away the memories of seeing great shows by Madball, SOIA, Murphy's Law, Agnostic Front........if you don't like em and think they suck, you are entitled to your opinion....but they were the trailblazers that provided you with the music that you listen to today..... RESPECT!

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ilikepunkrock (February 1, 2007)

No they didn't provide shit, LA Punk rock ownes NYHC, always remember that.

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

You're stupid. LA had just as much gang bullshit revolving around it. It's where the "punk" gangs originally started. Suicidals and LADS... Hell, Bad Religion were a LADS band. A lot of LA hardcore had violence and stupidity connected to it. It's a product of its time. And if by "LA punk" you mean '77 bullshit, I hope you're joking because LA's scene was just a parody of everything going on everywhere else.

-Will

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ilikepunkrock (February 1, 2007)

I don't really care about the past, I was just saying that guy was telling me to respect some NYHC shit when that music sucks and I was saying early LA punk owns that shit.

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

You don't care about the past....then you don't really care about the roots of the music you are listening to today. You don't have to be a fan, but you have to have respect.......

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

you will when you arent 14 anymore

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

Too bad most of the stuff you call LA "punk rock" is actually just the same hardcore. Moron.

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Billlumberg (July 30, 2010)

What're you talking about? It's not like all these bands toured and hung out together or anything....

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

another state of mind comes off almost as ignorant as this clip does so i guess i'll give you that.

Sick of it all

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Rastid (February 1, 2007)

^ win

really?
name some good examples then, and pretend like you were there.

Yeah piss poor... right... like there were many that were better from New York. Name one band that was a better example from New York in 1986. I dare you. Do you have any clue what you are talking about?

i disagree, i don't think it's racist at all. it's just saying how minorities get more government assistance than people that were born here. it should be even for everyone. they aren't after the minorities, they're after the lawmakers.

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woodandiron (February 1, 2007)

No, it was attacking the minorities for asking for assistance. Oh and most minorities are born here. Illegal aliens don't get welfare.

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

Regardless of who they're "after," it comes off as extremely racist from a scene that supposedly despises racism

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Rastid (February 1, 2007)

how is it different from guilty of being white?

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GlassPipeMurder (February 1, 2007)

Guilty of Being White is about the crimes of hatred your parents and grandparents and great grandparents committed against blacks and having the retribution taken out on you (or Ian MacKaye in this case).

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Rastid (February 1, 2007)

both songs are basically about how white (urban) poverty is a largely ignored problem.

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Billlumberg (July 30, 2010)

Ian Mackaye went to Wilson HS in DC, where, as a white kid, he was in the minority. He caught a lot of shit for it, and then wrote 'Guilty of being white."

"Guilty of Being White" is a very straightforward song, it's not really trying to make any kind of political point. And saying that it's about white urban poverty is either silly, or, if it's true, makes the song silly- those kids in Minor Threat all came from upper middle class backgrounds.

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

Agnostic Front used to be skinheads...DMS...Doc Marten Stompers...its lame, but get with the program

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

FUCK AGNOSTIC FRONT!! Fuck meathead hardcore bullshit

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

Check the 14th Amendment, Broham.

If you are born in the US, you are a citizen.

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the_other_scott (February 1, 2007)

where did he say differently

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the_other_scott (February 1, 2007)

there are definite racist undertones to the song (agnostic front and jello biaffra had some sort of "beef" over the song back in the day). but considering Roger is Puerto Rican (i think maybe he's dominican?) i think there's some understanding.

my view of this also changed when i moved across the street from a gigantic housing project, in a really really cheap apt. that i struggle to afford, while i see people in front of the projects all day every day not working and livving for free....i'm not saying its a vacation for them, but there is an understandable aspect of the song.

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FuckYouOiOiOi (February 1, 2007)

so if its so great why don't you do it?

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the_other_scott (February 1, 2007)

i'm not saying its a vacation for them,

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FuckYouOiOiOi (February 1, 2007)

yeah, that just to bail you out of taking sides. if your not saying that, then what the hell are you saying?

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

a vacation implies you work.

I was thinking the same thing. Anyone who doesn't think it is racist wasn't paying attention.

Jim

very racist. i have a hard time believing agnostic front isn't an overtly racist band now...do they have any anti-racist messages?

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joeg (February 1, 2007)

i'm not the biggest agnostic front fan but that claim you just made is based on everything but the facts. go listen to united and strong.

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GlassPipeMurder (February 1, 2007)

well i was basing it on the lyrics to the song.

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

I don't know how you figure that. One line in a song about how they feel on an issue and they are an overly racist band now. Minor Threat are Nazis too because of the song "Guilty of Being White".

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Someone (February 2, 2007)

minor threat are commenting about the privelege and guilt that comes from being white in an intelligent way...AF seem to just be finger pointing. the line "minorities with their gold chains" reminds me of something the redneck racist guys i work with would say followed by 'nigger'. AF may not be overtly racist in the song, but the underlying prejudice is definitely there and with what they say in a publicly heard song is probably toned down from what they say in the comfor of their own homes...pretty sad.

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Billlumberg (July 30, 2010)

Or, more likely, they wrote the song without thinking too much, and it's probably just about on par with what they say (or said) in the comfort of their own homes.

I don't really think anybody in Agnostic Front is any more or less racist than your average New Yorker on the street.

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

"do they have any anti-racist messages? "

yes, they do. you'll have to read for yourself though.

http://www.punkbands.com/lyrics/bands/agfront/lajfa.ht m

Isn't that from that one album AF hired somebody else to write?

It's not so much racist as reactionary, like Donahue said. Also stupid.

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

Also racist.

wow,like you really care...

Did ya ever think it was might have been true at the time?

Did ya ever think it might have been true at the time?

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

shut up.

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

shut up?
how bout suck poo poo,you fuckin lame-ass white college piece o' shit.

http://homepages.nyu.edu/~cch223/usa/info/af_NoAinter.html

an swers a lot of questions about "Public Assistance."

Yes

ahhh good oild ray cappo..could someone get him a glass of wine?

kids are dumbasses in general. I am not sure that this would be any different if they had any 18-25 non college students in New York City at this time. The Metal Heads are worse. You would have heard one line over and over.... YEAH WOOOOO FUCKING PRIEST BRO WOOOOOOO!!!

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

no... hardcore kids are douchebags now more than ever... its apparent at every show, every scene, every city...

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Rastid (February 1, 2007)

and you've obviously traversed every scene in every city to so determine.

seriously, dude, agnostic front, murphys law, sick of it all, harley's war all still put on awesome shows every time. no nazis, no fighting, no bullshit.

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

just a bunch of douchebags punching and kicking air... thats a great show!

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Rastid (February 1, 2007)

whereas punk is a bunch of douchebags knocking into each other?

either way, it's just kids having fun...

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Billlumberg (July 30, 2010)

I saw Sick of it All in Prague. No douchebaggery whatsoever. I met a really friendly hot Czech girl and hung out with some Serbian guys who were really cool.

Didn't catch any fists or elbows in the pit, either.

Easy to say that now sucklips.
A knob like you would been into music like "Winger" back then,thinking you were "so above" the punk scum.

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Someone (February 2, 2007)

no that would have been about the time i was into kenny loggins and loverboy

huh?

Your comment speaks for itself as well about you "oldsters". I don't thing I need to explain why.

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

You don't "thing"???

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

It's called a fucking typo. What are you the grammar police? For you ond people who didn't understand, the word is supposed to be "think".

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Someone (February 2, 2007)

what the hell does "ond" mean? if it is supposed to be "and" you're way off, and if it is supposed to be "old" you're still way off. if you're going to criticize don't let typos leave you so open to criticism.

I don't know man, here in Chicago, the hardcore scene is more alive and unified than it has been in several years. Lots of great bands are coming up, you just need to know where to look.

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Rastid (February 1, 2007)

yeah, chicago's scene is actually pretty sweet.

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FuckYouOiOiOi (February 1, 2007)

not to fight, just to exist.

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Someone (February 1, 2007)
Actually you sound like the idiot. You equate who you saw on the Donahue show with the morons that fucked you up? Why, because they're all from the East Coast? Those thugs have nothing to do with the kind of scene represented on the tv clip. You refer to that as unity - exactly my point you confused dunce - that's not unity at all nor is there much left whatsoever. Macho, insecure thugs are just that and never once did I say otherwise. And the judgmental and clueless kids on this site who comment about how dumb the people sounded on the show and where did those kids wind up, they're arrogant pricks for saying that. They're doing the same shit that regular people did to hardcore kids back in the '80's. The "scenes" today are safe, full of kids with stable, healthy homes, and are about as mainstream as it gets. You don't know what a real hardcore scene is.
Sorry you

show rest of commentActually you sound like the idiot. You equate who you saw on the Donahue show with the morons that fucked you up? Why, because they're all from the East Coast? Those thugs have nothing to do with the kind of scene represented on the tv clip. You refer to that as unity - exactly my point you confused dunce - that's not unity at all nor is there much left whatsoever. Macho, insecure thugs are just that and never once did I say otherwise. And the judgmental and clueless kids on this site who comment about how dumb the people sounded on the show and where did those kids wind up, they're arrogant pricks for saying that. They're doing the same shit that regular people did to hardcore kids back in the '80's. The "scenes" today are safe, full of kids with stable, healthy homes, and are about as mainstream as it gets. You don't know what a real hardcore scene is.
Sorry you got your ass kicked though. Next time don't push people who are only there fight.
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tenwestchaser (February 1, 2007)

Meh. I didn't get my ass kicked, I about did. I was smart enough not to do to much antagonizing and got out of the way asap. I was just saying that one would figure shoving someone who is hitting others woudln't expect a group of like 7 kids to sort of come out of the wood works. That just seems pretty unified to me. I doubt that kids have as much to be unified about these days, but my point was that they are still unifying. Also, are you turning your head to the growing crew scene across the country that I mentioned previously? It seems that straight edge crews (etc.) are growing daily. It seems to be a real problem as I keep hearing news about people actually being murdered.

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

Like I said - that's not unity - in fact it's the antithesis of it. It's a gang and only contributes to the breakdown of whatever scene there is. When shit like that started becoming more regular in New York, shit started going downhill. Period. Unity meant sticking up for each other within the scene, because mainstrream society did whatever they could to ridicule, discredit, and cut you down. It is a moot fucking point today. You use the word unity but in a completely different context.

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tenwestchaser (February 2, 2007)

" Unity meant sticking up for each other within the scene"

Isn't that what straight edge crews and crews like Courage Crew are doing though? Aren't they sticking up for straight edge or sticking up for their scene, against anyone and everyone who is different from them?

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

i agree partially. there was a kid beat to death here in new jersey recently at a show buy some asshole crew kids. THAT shit isnt the unity though that this video was talking about.

yawn. move along.

Sounds like Cliff Yablonski

You're an idiot, you can have that NYHC scene...I'll keep what we've got. Most of the punks in that clip, and the article that went along with it made it sound like any other teenage whim. Nothing about politics, just trying to get to the 'top of their scene'. What came from that scene anyways...born too late, what a joke. There's so much happening at the moment, we have a chance to have something way better...but not that you'll be around. dead too soon old man. boo fuckin' hoo.

You're an idiot, you can have that NYHC scene...I'll keep what we've got. Most of the punks in that clip, and the article that went along with it made it sound like any other teenage whim. Nothing about politics, just trying to get to the 'top of their scene'. What came from that scene anyways...born too late, what a joke. There's so much happening at the moment, we have a chance to have something way better...but not that you'll be around. dead too soon old man. boo fuckin' hoo.

You're an idiot, you can have that NYHC scene...I'll keep what we've got. Most of the punks in that clip, and the article that went along with it made it sound like any other teenage whim. Nothing about politics, just trying to get to the 'top of their scene'. What came from that scene anyways...born too late, what a joke. There's so much happening at the moment, we have a chance to have something way better...but not that you'll be around. dead too soon old man. boo fuckin' hoo.

You're an idiot, you can have that NYHC scene...I'll keep what we've got. Most of the punks in that clip, and the article that went along with it made it sound like any other teenage whim. Nothing about politics, just trying to get to the 'top of their scene'. What came from that scene anyways...born too late, what a joke. There's so much happening at the moment, we have a chance to have something way better...but not that you'll be around. dead too soon old man. boo fuckin' hoo.

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

dammit

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

nice triple post. It was way harder to be into that sort of thing back then. You don't understand. These people got beat up for looking like that. It wasn't accessable like it is today. Its all watered down. it used to be dangerous. We are smarter as a society now than before. If you interviewed non hardcore kids it would sound similar.

You damn kids!! *shakes fist*

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

hey old dude

two words

folk punk

and fuck sidekicks

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

folk punk?
so so cutting edge.
you crazy kids, what WILL you think of next?!
love, old dude

"You two were well aware of the fact that there was a homosexual advance made against me. Don't tell me I waited 6 months...3 weeks later I was on your rearend."

hahahahaha

shit comes out in less than a week.

you should be a real music fan for once, wait it out, and buy it.

yeah, compared to how brendan kelly repped on the daily show, we've come along way in the punk scene.

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

what!? i never saw that! is it on youtube???

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GlassPipeMurder (February 1, 2007)

yes. he does a pretty decent job.

So funny to see this 20 years later. I remember being that age at that time and going through all the "Hardcore kids are Evil" and "Metal kids are evil" and the censorship and all. It seemed So Serious back then.

All told, I think the kids that were in the audience, for the most part, represented themselves fairly well. I mean, for those older than 25 on here, how sophisticated did You look/come across at 16-19?

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Someone (February 1, 2007)

well put!

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Citizen_Crack (February 2, 2007)

I'm 16 and I don't think I come across as someone who failed English in 6th grade. That might be a little harsh, but you get my point. Maybe I do though, who knows.

Embarrissing to you because you're a gutless worm.

yeaaaah

hey, i have a great idea....why don't you suck on a shotgun asswipe?

Does it have anything to do with what you are in to? Thats how hardcore was back then. its funny that you didn't know that. One would say.... Ignorant.

don't worry. you're not part of any scene.

good,then please go back to mommy.

Haha, I remember seeing that back when it was first broadcast. To this day, I won't listen to GWAR because I remember (even at a young age) how lame their act was.

I've always seen Agnostic Front as just flat-out boneheads who knocked out a couple awesome records in their day ("United Blood" and "Victim in Pain"= classic). In that interview, he says he's friends with the guys from Youth Defense League (infamous white power band). It's pretty illustrative of how apolitical and lame the skinhead scene is. I don't know about you, but "white pride" to me doesn't make any sense and there's no reason for it given the lack of explicit white opression in this country.

I don't think AF were ever Nazis, but they definitely were friends with some of those types earlier on.

-Will

well, that line is pretty damn offensive. fuck AF.

YDL's bassist was Middle Eastern. Their drummer was Spanish. Seriously... being friends with YDL? Fence walkers? You're a judgmental, uninformed goofball.

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corporatecriminal (February 2, 2007)
"Middle Eastern" is a vague reference to a part of the world that includes a number of different nationalities and ethnicities. Someone can still be from the Middle East and be of European descent. Also, Spain is in Europe, so that is hardly evidence that the band isn't racist. Here's the lyrics to one of their songs. Explain to me how this is not coming from a Eurocentric, imperialist mindset. "Rid our country of alien greed?"

Pride and loyalty!

We are the youth of America, standing tall and proud
And we claim for our nation, the entire world
Our forefathers came to this country from Europe's proud family tree
And from the wilderness, like sculptors they carved a great country

Now it's up to us to start the struggle
Rid our country of alien greed
Then lead our people to newer glories
This could be

show rest of comment"Middle Eastern" is a vague reference to a part of the world that includes a number of different nationalities and ethnicities. Someone can still be from the Middle East and be of European descent. Also, Spain is in Europe, so that is hardly evidence that the band isn't racist. Here's the lyrics to one of their songs. Explain to me how this is not coming from a Eurocentric, imperialist mindset. "Rid our country of alien greed?"

Pride and loyalty!

We are the youth of America, standing tall and proud
And we claim for our nation, the entire world
Our forefathers came to this country from Europe's proud family tree
And from the wilderness, like sculptors they carved a great country

Now it's up to us to start the struggle
Rid our country of alien greed
Then lead our people to newer glories
This could be the start or the end of the story

Our bloodlines they run deep in the heart of other countries
But friend if you were born in America you are soon to see
That the fight must start to retain our identity
We must topple the powers that be, so that we can be free

Live free or die!
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Someone (February 2, 2007)

it seems to me the band cares more about honesty, hardwork, and the country than stupid pc shit. the point is that some people scam welfare, others really need it. if you see a lot of people scamming it, then you are not going to have a positive association with it, especially when you see this shit on your way to work a long day just to get by.

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corporatecriminal (February 2, 2007)

I'm assuming you're talking about "Public Assistance" because I don't know where you find "honesty" and "hardwork" in the YDL lyrics I posted. The point is that the Agnostic Front song sounds like it was written by Rush Limbaugh and that YDL was a white supremacist band that (at least some members of) Agnositic Front didn't mind being associated with.

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Someone (February 2, 2007)

YDL associated with pretty much Every NY band back in their day. From AF to GB to YOT to SOIA to...
They played shows with everybody. They had just as many sensible fans as racists.

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RobbieFree (February 2, 2007)

hahahhahahhahahhaha yeah, you're totally right, because spanish people have never held racist beliefs or done anything oppressive toward non-european peoples.

Amen

i third it.

Yeah, but if that's what you think the "scene" has become these days, it's because you aren't looking nearly as hard enough.

yeah, and whats with the short hair?

well written, seems like a genuinely good guy. too bad that those hardcore kids demonized him so badly as the generic 'mainstream enemy' who actually was into punk longer than they probably had been.

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Someone (February 3, 2007)

If you've ever read the actual article in New York magazine you'd see what sensationalizing tripe it actually is. Your judging him by his writing 20 years later and after the whole article blew up in his face. And I guranfuckingtee you he wasn't into punk longer than most of those guys in the audience.

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RobbieFree (February 5, 2007)

ive never read it, i admit...im just saying that on the shoe it made it seem like he was totally polarized to these kids, when actually they were very similar.

Wow, what a bunch of idiots.